6.5 HI V 6.5X55 AI

[Paul Janzso]

I am thinking about having a 6.5 barrel made up in the future and I would like some input into what is near optimum for this cal.

Also what is the 6.5 HI ?

I will be using 139gn Laouas or 142 SMK's

I was told by a reputable source that the 6.5x55AI is the optimum case for this cal then you enter the 6.5x284 barrel burner.

Also what would be the prefered barrel length?

I was also thinking about the 6.5x47 Lapua, but am unsure if suitable velocities can be reached in the small case.

Cheers
p b

[Ken L]

The 6.5 HI is a derivative of the 6.5 X 308 that eventualy became the 260 Remington. In the case of the HI the neck is lengthened without changing the measurement between the head and the shoulder. This caused the shoulder angle to increase to more like the Ackley.

The first chambers were cut with a 6.5 X 57 AI reamer cut to 52mm instead of the usual 57 mm. After the case was developed Keith Hills sent information to Pacifice Tool and Die and they now make a 6.5 Hi reamer.
I still cut chambers with the 57m reamer.
The barrel I use gives me 139 Lapua projectiles running at 2930 fps with 2209 powder in the low 40 gn weight range, out of necked down 308 Lapua cases. It is a docile cartridge that has only a little more recoil than the 6BR and in the right hands can be just as accurate. At longer ranges there is a small but noticable advantage over the 6 BR with 105 gn lapua"s and IMHO is only bested by a 6mm Rem running 105's at 3200 fps.
My elevation settings at 1000 yards from a 300 yard zero are;
6.5 HI = 21 Moa velocity 1616 fps at 1000 and 1386 fps at 1200 y
6mm Rem = 19.75 velocity 1595 fps at 1000 and 1341 fps at 1200
6 BR =27.5 Moa velocity 1326 fps at 1000 and 1096 fps ( sub sonic) at 1200 y

I havent seen any elevation & velocity data for the 6.5 X 47 as yet.

If you have available weight limit to spare the a 32 inch barrel with a long knox-form allows for higher velocities and rechambering.
The Hi is much easier on barrel life than the 6.5 X 284 and yet has comparable velocities.

[Paul Janzso]

Hi Ken

Thanks for your reply.

What does the HI stand for?

What dies are available for the 6.5HI ?

What load data is available?

The 6.5 HI seems like a fine cal, cartrige for rougher conditions compared to 6mm BR, 6x47 (lapua), and possibly outshines the 6MM Rem with the higher BC bullets.

I also like the barrel longevety compared to the 6.5x284

Thanks Ken.

p b

[Ken L]

Hi Ken

Thanks for your reply.

What does the HI stand for?

What dies are available for the 6.5HI ?

What load data is available?

The 6.5 HI seems like a fine cal, cartrige for rougher conditions compared to 6mm BR, 6x47 (lapua), and possibly outshines the 6MM Rem with the higher BC bullets.

I also like the barrel longevety compared to the 6.5x284

Thanks Ken.

p b

HI is Hills Improved
I use standard Forster 260 rem seating die and a Lee Collet Die for decaping and neck sizing. As for pushing the neck back to make it a long neck case that is a handmade die cut with the roughing reamer that is ground to a resizing die measurements. I use a standard full length 260 rem sizing die to take the 308 cases down to 6.5 then the custom resizing die to lengthen the neck. then fireform using some 144 gn Lapua FMJ projectiles that are cheaper. This also allows the barrel to be run in.

Ken L

[Paul Janzso]

Hi Ken

Thank you for that info.

Just a last q.

What does the standard 260 rem compare to the 6.5 HI ?

Cheers
p b

[Ken L]

PB

The HI gives better head space consistancy and having a longer neck it gives longer barrel life and generaly slightly higher velocities and by converting 308 cases the neck is thicker and as such allows for enough neck turning to clean up and give constant neck thickness. As well as those improvements attributed to Ackley Improved performance.

Ken L

[Paul Janzso]

Thank's Ken

Cheers
p b

[ogre6br]

How about this one.

6.5x55 slightly short chambered and then using a 6MM BR Norma reamer to clean out the chamber to a 6.5BRx55.

30 degree shoulder, minimum case taper, nice long neck,
Fireform 6.5x55 brass with projectile stuck in the lands.
Give a few grains extra capacity
will still feed from the magazine if required.
Using lapua brass you can load it nice and warm as stil have plenty of safety margin.

FLS die can be made using a 6mmBR roughing or sizing reamer.

Can use a Hornady new generation 6.5x55 seater- add a Hornady "microjust" top and ream out the sliding sleeve to suit.
6.5x55 ammo can be used in it to fireform brass.


sort of an easy Wildcat to make and will run with a 40 Deg AI and a 6.5x284 quite easliy and burn less powder and have a longer barrel life.

I'm planning mine for the Tikka 695 master Sporter.

The same priciple has been used to creat a .243 TBR and then neck it upto 6.5mm

(snip from 6mm BR.com) http://www.6mmbr.com/BlogSept2005.html

WILDCAT DEN--Fireball's "Tall BR": WarrenB ("FireBall") has devised a simple way to improve the performance of the .243 Win: "I call this my '6mmTBR', which is a .243 with the long neck and 30° shoulder of the 6BR case. I simply took Lapua .243 brass and ran it into a 6mmBR body die to give the .243 a 6BR top end. The resulting cartridge is like a Tall BR, hence the 'TBR' name. I shoot the TBR in a Panda and it is incredibly accurate. Combine the TBR with a 70gr Nosler BT and you have an awesome windy-day Prairie Dog rifle. Or you could use it competition. At 600 yards, I think the TBR would give the 6XC, 6-250 and other mid-size 6mms a run for their money. And if you already have 6BR dies there are no tooling costs involved. Plus you get to use Lapua brass. The 6XC and 6-250 can't claim that!" [Editor's note--The TBR rivals the 6-284 with much lower brass cost.]

(endsnip)

LAter
p

[Paul Janzso]

HI Pat

Looks good, keep me informed.

Cheers
p b

[Ackley Improved]

I have just decided on a 6.5X55AI.

What I have found is finding a FL die is a little difficult.

Seater and neck is no problem.

CHeers
AI

[AlanF]

AI,

If you're prepared to pay around US$200, you can get a custom FL sizing die with neck bushing and decapper from any one of several custom die-makers in the US. Most will ask for a few cases fired (best after several firings) in your chamber.

I believe 6.5x55 will be a very good chambering - might have gone that way myself instead of 6.5x284 if I'd known more about it. Are you intending to shoot in Vic? I'm reliably told that there's are few shooters about to start shooting F-Open in your area.

Alan

[Ackley Improved]

Alan

It appears that a custom will be the way to go. Yes, they seem to all want 3 cases fired around 4 times.

Well, I really have not hit the F Class scene yet.. but soon I will be. I shoot Fly.

I think that you would be talking about the Tallangatta Rifle range. Nice set up they have too!!

I think the 6.5X55AI is nicely balanced, and is now my favoured choice for a 6.5cal.

I really would have thought that the 6.5X55AI would have had a FL die that was readily available for it!

Cheers
AI

[ogre6br]

Redding makes a 6.5x55 AI die set but it's in their custom range.

Here is another option

http://www.6mmbr.com/catalog/item/1433308/892435.htm

A guy in the states fits neck bushings to Redding body dies and hones them for a just right fit.

heres one way of getting a micro adjustable seater
http://www.6mmbr.com/catalog/item/1433308/945450.htm

another way is to get a Hornady new generation seater, buy the seperate microadjustable top and have your smith make up a new sliding sleeve to suit the die.
The sleeves in the Hornady arn't hardened so you could just ream the factory sleeve.
I dont know whether lee make a Collet necking die for the 6.5x55- that might be an option. A standard 223 Lee collet die necksizes and decaps .223 40 Deg AI cases fine so I dont see why the same wouldn't hold true for the 6.5x55 to 6.5x55AI. the 233 doesn't size all of the neck on the 223AI it leaves a little bit on neck size so it can act as a centering aid when chambering the round. I seat my projectiles above this slightly un sized bit and there is still a caliber of projectile shank in the neck.

though these guys here seem to not like the leaving the little bit of unsized neck- so they give you the contact details or Forester cutomer service that will custom hone you die to suit.
http://www.6mmbr.com/catalog/item/1433308/1464783.htm

just something else for you to think about.

Oh and last time I emailled Harrels they didin't do a 6.5x55 die of any sort- as I wanted them to amke me a die to suit my 6.5BRx55 idea----but they will do a 30 BR so I'll be getting them to do both 6BR and 30 BR dies to match my cases when I have the $$ for SC to build them.

later
P

[Ackley Improved]

Well I have found my FL die. Its coming from a well respected benchrest shooter in the US. I am also buying the reamer to suit the die.

It is not worth going half arsed, specially when the rifle has cost me the best part of $6500.

A custom die was goingt o cost around the $275US, as the two custom die makers did not have the reamer for the basis of the FL die, so there was a added 50US for themt o hire it.

The die I have found is $150US, and the reamer.. well, still getting price.

The die will match my chamber well!

Cheers
AI

[CEW]

From what I understand there are two people here in Aus that can make dies to any configuration required by measurement of cases or just by a a chamber drawing and then machined on a CNC . I believe that both do barrel chambers in this way aswell, one does for certain as I have seen the finished product. The person I have spoken to and seen has shown me a die that is a bump, base die and with the addition of a spacer also becomes a very precise seater die aswell. All that is then required is a neck die which both do as a machined unit or as a bushing setup.
There are a number of people in the US using CNC and or EDM to produce both chambers and dies and when I was shown the tolerances and finish quality of what a reamer can produce as opposed to a CNC, I am certain that this is the way of the future. The dies and chambers are already in use here in Aus and by some very well known shooters even though the method is not spoken about much. As for cost, this is what really suprised me, a bump seater die and the necker, not the bushing type, were both less than a standard set of dies for the run of the mill die set for some hunting guns. The problem is though that niether deal with the public and the guy in Adelaide has all but left the shooting scene. My mate in NQ will only do work for the locals and even then is very selective. Most unfortunate as there is a market for this kind of stuff. If you PM me i will pass on a contact and you can take it from there.
Peter.