Proposal to Limit F/TR Projectiles to 156 Grains

[Tim L]

A little bit off the specific subject, but as we're being asked for input on something I didn't know we had input on, I'd like to suggest that Australia propose (or support a proposal from any other country) for a move to 10 ring target.

[DannyS]

Hi Jas, I have read the full story. My comment re FS was brought about by people in this story making comments about pedestals rest in FS.

[Barry Davies]

Just for the record.
The discipline that aligns closest with TR ( ICFRA ) is FS.

[AlanF]

Yes Alan, really.
TR in ICFRA is allowed unlimited weight rifle and 0.5 kg trigger. TR ( aus ) is 6.5kg rifle and 1kg trigger. Significant differences.
The only disciplines closely aligned to ICFRA are FO and F/TR. The closest TR and FS come to it is the target.

That's interesting. I've never taken the trouble to read the ICFRA rules for TR. When the ICFRA targets were adopted here, I had the impression that everything was being aligned with ICFRA. So does that mean when we hosted the TR World Championships at Belmont a few years back, there was no weight limit on rifles?

[Barry Davies]

Not sure about that --I think maybe the rule was changed after Brisbane, but not sure.

[Matt P]

Yes Alan, really.
TR in ICFRA is allowed unlimited weight rifle and 0.5 kg trigger. TR ( aus ) is 6.5kg rifle and 1kg trigger. Significant differences.
The only disciplines closely aligned to ICFRA are FO and F/TR. The closest TR and FS come to it is the target.

That's interesting. I've never taken the trouble to read the ICFRA rules for TR. When the ICFRA targets were adopted here, I had the impression that everything was being aligned with ICFRA. So does that mean when we hosted the TR World Championships at Belmont a few years back, there was no weight limit on rifles?

Being an ICFRA event (the host country, is simply the host) ICFRA rules are what the competition is run under, the only exceptions are with regard to safety templates, energy limits etc.
Our NRAA cherry picks what they think the shooters want (without asking) or what helps the bottom line (limited bullet selection).
Matt P

[bobped]

Hi Again,
Please remember that Australia is only one of 1of 12 countries that will be voting on this matter, so we are only one voice among many. I'm only trying to get an indication of how to advise our own Board about this. Going off on other tangents about rules or someone's pet peeves doesn't get me very far.
Bob Pedersen

[jasmay]

Alan, may I suggest a poll for this topic would be very good here....

[G.T]

I am not in favour of changing of the project weight limits for FTR. I sympathise with the South African shooters issues however I'm not in favour of any changes.

It is people's choices to run what ever projectile weight they would prefer to use and The consequences that go with the them. Remembering there is pluses and minuses for both lighter weight and heavier weighted projectiles.

I started in F standard, with a bipod and the restrictions. When it came time to build a new rifle I decided on FTR as I could still shoot standard but had the ability to shoot an international formula. So if it was to become restricted with a projectile weight I could have saved my money and stayed with F standard and lightened the trigger to do FTR.

Whatever happens, I just hope that our sport and classes we'll continue to see people enjoy themselves and foster good competition between us all.

[argh]

My thoughts, for what its worth:
I choose to shoot F-STD as it gives an even playing field for all competitors in terms of wind reading, where as F Open can sometimes come down to who has the best wind bucking ability in BC to velocity/cartridge choice, and the wind drift differences - better ballistics means a definite advantage in wind shits and fewer dropped shots - but that is exactly the point of F Open -being competition of the gear combined with the wind reading skills (no disrespect to open at all). I choose F Std for the even playing field in respect of wind reading. F/TR is a bit newer than my start in this journey so with my investment in F-std I was not about to go to F/TR to align with international events.
Summary - I like and support the F-Std comp in Australia, just like many many club shooters around Australia as reflected in the number of F Std shooters at club and prize meet shoots.

If F/TR was to limit to 156gr, then it would bring it much closer to F STD and the only difference would be the front rest... is this enough to warrant the three different F Class disciplines? I dont think so.

F Open is our formula one of our sport,
F Std is the choice for those that like to 1. not spend as much on gear and barrel replacements, and 2. want an even playing field in wind reading (155gr projectiles from a 308 and 80's from a 223)
F TR is for those that want to compete internationally or in an international level comp. I think in many ways that F/TR is still a bit of a gear/ballistics comp with throwing as heavy a projectile as possible (and keeping brass reuse manageable) to buck the wind, rather than everyone shooting the same cal and having the same wind drift and an even playing field in wind reading ability, like possibly the original intent was.

If T/TR was limited to projectile choice like F STD, one would eventually die off - and it would probably be F Std that would die off. I personally would move to open and screw in a 6BR barrel, I like a front rest and not a bipod.

I personally dont want to see the change, and my vote is against 156 gr for FTR

Our F Std is the level playing field that others may want

Cheers
Adrian

[Ray Hurley]

I would assume the problems stem from an availability of projectiles in South Africa. They struggle with barrels and powder supply as well. Personally I reckon the changes would set ftr back,it's the option to play with loads and powder that attracted me to it in the first place

[Matt P]

Bob
Has this been sent to the states ???
Nothing can happen until the states make a recommendation.
Matt P

[Gyro]

"Argh/Julian" ..... at last, some sensible critical thinking !!!

[Gyro]

I meant "Argh/Adrian". Apologies.

[dvjtomcat]

I didn't know they shot F Standard in South Africa !
The heavy projectiles we use e.g. 200-215g provide sufficient challenge to offset the higher BCs
F/TR is a great competition as is: leave well enough alone

tomcat.