Positive Compensation

[Razer]

I fully appreciate all the information being posted, but, I would like to just make the comment that the average shooter will be totally overwhelmed by the technical content and feel that they will never ever be competitive or, possibly become disillusioned as to their own ability.
Please be reassured that it is not necessary to be fully conversant in ultimate ballistic theory to shoot 60's at 1000yards.
With the right barrel and load tune it is achievable as I have done this at Bendigo accompanied by the scorers rye comments as each score came up; "barrel must be fouling, that one wasn't quite right on the waterline".
I even kept my sighters. This barrel, a 2006 Truflite Palma, with the same load, also shot excellent waterline between 500yards and the 1000yards and the metric equivalents in between. This was using the old Sierra 2155 and 2006H and PMC mag primers.

This is only an example, not a post of personal achievement as there are many who shoot excellent waterline at all distances. I also shoot a 308W which gives me more latitude when seeking a tune whereas FO calibres do not have the barrel life to play around as much as I did.
The contributions made by David, David Mc, Peter Smith and a couple of others is giving a huge number of shooters insight into superior ballistics and should probably be quarantined to prevent overseas shooters gaining any edge from it.
We are privileged to have such a great forum with many excellent contributions.

[jasmay]

I fully appreciate all the information being posted, but, I would like to just make the comment that the average shooter will be totally overwhelmed by the technical content and feel that they will never ever be competitive or, possibly become disillusioned as to their own ability.
Please be reassured that it is not necessary to be fully conversant in ultimate ballistic theory to shoot 60's at 1000yards.
With the right barrel and load tune it is achievable as I have done this at Bendigo accompanied by the scorers rye comments as each score came up; "barrel must be fouling, that one wasn't quite right on the waterline".
I even kept my sighters. This barrel, a 2006 Truflite Palma, with the same load, also shot excellent waterline between 500yards and the 1000yards and the metric equivalents in between. This was using the old Sierra 2155 and 2006H and PMC mag primers.

This is only an example, not a post of personal achievement as there are many who shoot excellent waterline at all distances. I also shoot a 308W which gives me more latitude when seeking a tune whereas FO calibres do not have the barrel life to play around as much as I did.
The contributions made by David, David Mc, Peter Smith and a couple of others is giving a huge number of shooters insight into superior ballistics and should probably be quarantined to prevent overseas shooters gaining any edge from it.
We are privileged to have such a great forum with many excellent contributions.

These are wise words Razer, I find myself bogged down with this and not knowing which way to turn at times, its compounded by the fact a lot of answers to questions are not easy to garner purely from research, and practical testing and experience is required as there is no "Go To Manual" for any of these systems, which, without some direct supervision from those in the know quite often leaves us scratching our heads.

I've nearly all but gone back to the "just do it" mentality as rounds down range and tweaking on the go is seeming to yield similar results to those using these methods (Perhaps not to their full due to their complexity). You must follow some basic principles, but it is easy to get lost amongst all this advanced ballistic talk and end up further behind the pack due to lack of practice at the coal face.

[johnk]

Hey, it's nice to see a couple of guys writing in English even.

[Norm]

I see the main problem with getting a good load for 1000 yard shooting is that we do our club shooting mostly during the worst time of day when good conditions are rare. They are down this way.

When I do my ELR testing I pick the best time of day for testing and only shoot when conditions are perfect. This is usually early in the morning before the sun comes up with Nil wind. Under these conditions you can shoot some fantastic groups at 1000 yards and way beyond. Shoot the same loads during the middle of the day at the same distances and you will see just how much conditions effect performance.

[AlanF]

I see the main problem with getting a good load for 1000 yard shooting is that we do our club shooting mostly during the worst time of day when good conditions are rare. They are down this way...

Agreed. At nearby Rosedale we get good practice at handling rough conditions, but little opportunity to gauge accuracy of our equipment. I actually prefer the more leisurely hours approaching sunset for testing - its hard to get good help before breakfast .

[DaveMc]

Yes Alan - my preference too - Interestingly early morning on my range was always suffering from a mirage effect and the "settling period was very short (cool land, warm air or vice versa) whereas the afternoon would always settle nicely. Warm ground from the sun all day and as soon as the sun got low or disappeared behind the mountain range things would equalize nicely for an hour or more. (From very severe mirage over a moist cane field in the tropics during the day). Most would find it interesting the amount of mirage at night.....-
Yes it is remarkable the difference in group size in good conditions and a necessity when trying to sort the finer intricacies of these types of discussions. We were very fortunate to have such a facility to allow that every day.

The good news for all of you guys totally bemused by all this is that for the myriad of load development techniques out there, there is very few "wrong" ways to do it. Providing your system ends up with you shooting good groups you are heading in the right direction. This can be done in single string audette ladders to strings of 3 and 5 shot groups (or any other combinations - just going out to the range with different loads and shooting matches). Anything that helps you find the area that your rifle is shooting its best.

Long range load development can be done at short range with a good chronograph or long range with good conditions and you can even get good results with neither but just good loading practices.

[plumbs7]

I've learnt so much of this forrum and of the 2 daves . We are truly fortunate to have such tech skill for us newbies to latch onto.

Dave W has taught me a lot to recognise group shapes for tune at 100 m ( should be 140m) and I would attribute some of my recent limited success to him and the ability to tune a rifle .

My head hurts sometimes trying to understand this stuff but it's good fun !

I've often wandered if we should be sharing some of the finer points of harmonics and tune for overseas competitors to see? But everyone has been disciplined in not showing our work with tuners and mass weights .

But again ,between Peter S, and the 2 Daves we really are fortunate ! Thanks heaps!

[plumbs7]

Since I would be most prolific group posterer!
.284 win and limited load development.
100 m group is about 10 rounds on the barrel and about 6 shots.


Then other 2 are at 1000 with about 25 rounds on the barrel. In very crap conditions! The last won shot just before a storm in at Matt P speed of about 2 mins !
I was stoked at the waterline and if it were in good conditions my belief is it would have been pretty flat! So much could have gone wrong and been a failure ! Some say you can get lucky ? I say thanks willadia ( and Rod )!