Cream of Wheat fire forming ?

[plumbs7]

Hi My Mates ! With my 7-08 Ai cases at up to 15 firings and now starting leak around the primers . I've put it off as long as .and I can only run slow 168 loads and it's just a pain ! So I need a batch of newbies !
I've heard about fire forming with cream of wheat and wondered what and how are people doing it?
And does its stuff a highly accurate comp barrel? Do they clean after every 5 fire formings?
Regards Graham.

[plumbs7]

Well , can understand with nobody commenting, could be a tricky subject!
So I had some 2207 and toilet paper for wadding . Started out with 23 gr and was a nice pop! But didn't do anything in terms of fire forming.
Then went to 41 gr and fired it . Was a nice boom but only have did the job ! Went to 46 gr and fired it and it was just as load as normal with a 3 ' flame out the muzzle . Was quite impressive on Dusk and even recoiled a little ! Would have even fooled a movie camera!
Below is the result ! Just barely fireformed!


Patched out barrel and was very dirty !

That was second patch !

Obviously a pistal powder is needed and reading into it , it's about 10% of the case capacity that the pistal powder is able to fill!
I'm not going to do it on this Bart barrel as for it's really come on tune of late ( seems to be !even after 1500 rounds). So I don't believe you want to carbon up the throats and maybe promote throat erosion!
If I had a stuffed 7 mm barrel , I would cut to min legal length chamber with same reamer and then maybe play around fireforming with Cream of wheat method .
Feel free to add or comment ?
Regards Graham.

[BATattack]

What about a cast lead bullet?

[Sam Walker]

Fast powder like Trail Boss and try a foam earplug packed down past the shoulder instead of the dunny paper.

[Tim N]

Get a hydraulic case former?
Or just load and shoot as normal if it's not too hot

[plumbs7]

The earplug idea sounds good . Finding a 7 mm cast bullet maybe a stretch and lead fouling in a hummer barrel could be an issue.

Tim I think just loading up some 110 grainers and going to the farm and having some fun breaking clays ! It's only for prize meets so only need 75 rounds on ave for a 2 day shoot. With 308 brass $80/100 when I bought my last lot. By the time I FF them they would be very close to the price of .284 lap brass.
But please for the sake of others who might want to FF without bullets , please keep the comments coming !

[RDavies]

I while ago I used to use pistol powders with a toilet paper plug and cases formed 90% of the way but then I started to wonder about what it was doing to the rifling, just skipping over the top like that, maybe nothing but I didn't want to risk it with good barrels after that. Now I just use trail boss behind spare old bullets in my junk bullet pile. You can fire 50 rounds of trail boss without your barrel getting hot so no throat erosion, it is also much quieter than normal loads. Maybe load up a pile with trail boss and just use it for plinking at the local SSAA range.

[scott/r]

I'm not sure that I would be using earplugs as a bung. At least toilet paper would burn off reasonably clean compared to the gunk you would end up with burning an earplug. Another option I've read about is wax, but I'm not sure if I'd run that through a good barrel.
Personally I've always just used projectiles that I've had left over or ones that have been assigned to the "practice" box with a light load behind them.

[BATattack]

I while ago I used to use pistol powders with a toilet paper plug and cases formed 90% of the way but then I started to wonder about what it was doing to the rifling, just skipping over the top like that, maybe nothing but I didn't want to risk it with good barrels after that. Now I just use trail boss behind spare old bullets in my junk bullet pile. You can fire 50 rounds of trail boss without your barrel getting hot so no throat erosion, it is also much quieter than normal loads. Maybe load up a pile with trail boss and just use it for plinking at the local SSAA range.

That's not a bad idea! I have a big jug of trail boss and nothing to use it in at the moment. How well does it form the case? I'm thinking of using it more so to fire form new brass to a standard chamber rather than for improved cases.

[RDavies]

I while ago I used to use pistol powders with a toilet paper plug and cases formed 90% of the way but then I started to wonder about what it was doing to the rifling, just skipping over the top like that, maybe nothing but I didn't want to risk it with good barrels after that. Now I just use trail boss behind spare old bullets in my junk bullet pile. You can fire 50 rounds of trail boss without your barrel getting hot so no throat erosion, it is also much quieter than normal loads. Maybe load up a pile with trail boss and just use it for plinking at the local SSAA range.

That's not a bad idea! I have a big jug of trail boss and nothing to use it in at the moment. How well does it form the case? I'm thinking of using it more so to fire form new brass to a standard chamber rather than for improved cases.

The trail boss loads will form 6 Dasher and 284 Shehane brass fully.
If I don't have a fireforming barrel, even my non improved brass first gets fired in a lower pressure load before I give it full pressure and plinking with Trail boss works great for this. You can go through 50 rounds of shooting clay lumps at the SSAA range at 300-500 yds with a 1500 fps load without getting the barrel warm while cases get formed fully.

[BATattack]

I while ago I used to use pistol powders with a toilet paper plug and cases formed 90% of the way but then I started to wonder about what it was doing to the rifling, just skipping over the top like that, maybe nothing but I didn't want to risk it with good barrels after that. Now I just use trail boss behind spare old bullets in my junk bullet pile. You can fire 50 rounds of trail boss without your barrel getting hot so no throat erosion, it is also much quieter than normal loads. Maybe load up a pile with trail boss and just use it for plinking at the local SSAA range.

That's not a bad idea! I have a big jug of trail boss and nothing to use it in at the moment. How well does it form the case? I'm thinking of using it more so to fire form new brass to a standard chamber rather than for improved cases.

The trail boss loads will form 6 Dasher and 284 Shehane brass fully.
If I don't have a fireforming barrel, even my non improved brass first gets fired in a lower pressure load before I give it full pressure and plinking with Trail boss works great for this. You can go through 50 rounds of shooting clay lumps at the SSAA range at 300-500 yds with a 1500 fps load without getting the barrel warm while cases get formed fully.

sounds like a plan!

[plumbs7]

Here is some very useful info on trailboss powder .
http://www.sportingshootermag.com.au/ne ... ifle-loads

[Sam Walker]

the earplugs don't burn, just get spat out of the barrel.

[plumbs7]

I'm going to put my Bart on the line here ! .... no that's Bartlein not Butt! Hehe! This barrel for one reason or another has just come on song ( at the moment lol!). 1500 rounds , so going to put it on the line and try FF with pistol powder...and ear plugs!

I was unable to get trailboss but the above was the next best available! Ok first up this worked for me in my rifle and due care and attention is needed.
First up I filled my case to the top 7-08 rem. then weighed it . It came to 28 grains and then I x by %40 and started at 12 gr! Maybe for others start lower again!

I went all the way to 14.5 gr but the shoulder was just the same as 12 gr but with more heat and noise ! So went back to 12 gr !
Then cut a strip about 12 mm wide of dunny paper and pushed in up again the powder to help it stay against the primer to stop detention ( very bad)



Then pressed in firm with an Allen key .

Then seated a fresh earplug in the neck!


Then take down to the rifle range and fire ! The earplug just turns to mush and spat out the other side !

The round on the left is a 15 times fired veteran 7-08 Ai . The middle is a case fired with a 100 grainer over 43 gr 2206h. The case on the right is the formed by pistol powder. So no real difference , both cases about 90% formed and reading for Northarm

I cleaned every 10 to 15 rounds formed . Even though you are firing blanks , the muzzle can still kill and injure ! So be careful ! The noise is a lot better than full rounds and my wife is happy and so is the dog ! And the kids !
Not to sure if you would get away with this method in the city . A closed shed can be bad with the gun powder fumes not a good thing in large amounts!
On a rural property, this is the ticket ! No reason for old cases no more !
The rifle needed a real good clean after and came back mirror finished after about 10 patches!
I think it's the lessor of 2 evils ! Either throw 100 grainers or 168 reduced loads and add more wear on the barrel.
Or have most of the pressure in the case with pistol powder pushing foam ear plugs that don't touch the barrel!
I'll let it a know if there is any adverse effect ! But looks good so far!
So this is very cost effective method and no inert filler needed!

[Andy B]

That took guts putting your good Bartlein on the line there!!

What does the cost of the plugs work out to be per firing in comparison?