Dyer HBC's.

[richmac]

Hi All
I have been talking to a few people regarding the Dyer 155 Hbc projectiles. They had a few supply probs awhile back owing to machine problems.
Since this has happened quite a few shooters have commented on how the profile has changed slightly and the specs are different, Where you had your jump you now have to advance it as they are 12 tho shorter.
Also quite a few shooters have commented on the groups being larger.
Has anyone had problems with them?
Check your ogive and see if you have a variance.

[Brad Y]

Its still being used to devestating effect over here. Bloke hit a 60.8 at 800 on sunday in some pretty nasty fishtailing winds. Same loads as the old ones too. 10 thou jam is working in most guns.

[IanP]

I'm new to shooting the 308W but not to load development and found the difference in the new projectiles to be substantial. I could not get a decent group with the new version of bullets using the load I originally developed.

It took ages to to get the group size down to 0.5 moa and even then with the unexplained occasional vertical flyer. This was done using the same barrel as before with the original HBCs. The seating depth is different old to new as the new bullet sits further into the throat.

It seems in conversation with local and interstate experienced FS shooters that the new HBC batches are not as good as the old! Please add your comments on what you have found using them!

Ian

[Sambo]

I'm really keen to get this post going again.

I bought 1000 x batch 17 HBC's in January and have happily been working through them with great results. However the WA Queens is on in a month or so and I will need to purchase more projectiles prior.

I want to do it soon so I can make sure they are working well before the Queens. Do I go with the new batch HBC's (first preference), or try sierra's?

Keep in mind I'm a TR shooter so I'm not chasing the same accuracy as you F-class blokes.

[Brad Y]

Dunno if WARA has any HBC's. I will be in swanbourne next saturday to have a look. They have been out for a few weeks- hoping stock will be there soon. Lots of people have been shooting sierras and they arent that common around the place either... might be a pretty average queens this year over here.

[bruce moulds]

rumours are circulating that numbers of bergers are being shot in qld now.
not sure in what context.
while bjd bullets might be good, it is starting to look like where there is smoke there is fire.
i don't shoot a 308, but i could be tempted to get the old sleeved rem rebarreled.
should this happen it will be an 11 twist barrel aimed at ftr. in part this decision is based on supply and quality questions surrounding bjd. at least ftr offers the opportunity to use any bullet.
it is all very well to try to support aussie suppliers, but they need to live up to an ethos of knowing market demand and requirement, or they are just abusing a privelidge.
some years ago i had some faulty berger products, made prior to the current proprieters, and when i complained they admitted fault, and sent me 400 bullets at their cost.
that is customer focus, and it paid off for them and me.
other companies try to blame the customer for their second rate performance, and it works for awhile, but in the end they reap what they sow.
keep safe,
bruce.

[Brad Y]

Bruce

A couple of guys here tried the berger VLD 155's the other week at a club shoot with good results. Would like to get ahold of some hybrids to try in that weight for sure but from what Ive heard bergers are pretty hard to get ahold of too.

Lots of guys here have been shooting sierras (the old model) with awesome results. But they are getting hard to find too.

The increase in 308's over here is pretty interesting to note. Hopefully the same will happen with open again soon.

[saum2]

Any particular batch of HBC's that are causing grief?????
Geoff

[Sambo]

The WARA shop is struggling to keep up with demand for HBC's. Last week Tony told me he has sold 130,000 since the new supply arrived. That's about the same amount he sold last year.

So plenty of people will be shooting them at the Queens. Essentially I am just doing some "due diligence" on deciding whether to buy another 1000 of them. It'll take a fair bit to convince me that I should use something else.

What exactly is wrong with the new lot of HBC? One bloke found a 1 grain weight spread in a bag of 200. That doesn't worry me too much as I weight sort. Someone else said the new lot was shorter than the old and they had to adjust their seating depth. Again doesn't really worry me.

Anything else that people have found?

[bruce moulds]

i have found over the years that there are bullets and barrels that while they are quite adequate for sling shooting, and will never cause question in that area, are insufficient for fclass.
these will usually hold about half way between the x ring and 6 ring, which might just be passable for fclass if they did not have the odd flyer into the 5 ring.
like i said, you don't need better than this for off the elbows with the scoring rings in use for that job.
one must be careful not to blame the bullet if it is the barrel or vice/versa, and this is very hard to isolate.
however it is a bit like a brand of primers that have had one missfire. you probably won't go there again!
keep safe,
bruce.

[johnk]

rumours are circulating that numbers of bergers are being shot in qld now.

Could it be consequential to members of the Aussie F/TR team working up loads here & elsewhere for Raton?

Frankly, Bruce, stories of illegal ammo & the like are starting to pall. Recently, it was Victoria; this time it's Queensland's turn. It's starting to sound like dodgy ammo can be spotted better from a State or two's distance than by the officials & competitors involved in a match.

[Brad Y]

Sambo- I found one more thing about the HBC's today. But i found it on someone elses target. 60.10. They will obviously work, might need some tweaking but they work.

Interesting about the number sold. Obviously thats the increase in 308's for ya. Theres 6 new 308's at our club in F class alone. In the new members that have arrived, none have expressed interest in building 223's at all. Only one is regularly used at our firing line now. I guess when someone has one cranking and beats the 308's at a queens it might get a resurgence. Until that time these 308's are going to get more popular.

[Sambo]

The other part of it is that the blokes who used to buy their projies by the 100, got stung when there was the supply interruption and now they have bought the full box.

[IanP]

Sambo- I found one more thing about the HBC's today. But i found it on someone elses target. 60.10. They will obviously work, might need some tweaking but they work.

Interesting about the number sold. Obviously thats the increase in 308's for ya. Theres 6 new 308's at our club in F class alone. In the new members that have arrived, none have expressed interest in building 223's at all. Only one is regularly used at our firing line now. I guess when someone has one cranking and beats the 308's at a queens it might get a resurgence. Until that time these 308's are going to get more popular.

Brad, do you actually shoot a 308W in F-Class or just passing on your observations of what you see others doing? If you shoot the new HBCs what has been your personal findings with them in relation to accuracy and bullet seating depth, etc?

Ian

[Brad Y]

Hi Ian

Yes I do shoot 308W. However when we had the last supply issue (and I was one of the people that bought a hundred or two at a time) I ended up sourcing a box of 900 of the batch 15 projectiles from another member on this forum. So Im actually shooting some of the older shape ones.

However my observations are on other shooters claiming to use the same loads- I believe them when they say that too.

We tried a little experiment yesterday with some different primers which turned my old bullets and the someones new bullets ones into shotgun patterns on the target, but the one guy who didnt try the new primers hit the 60.10 and 60.6 Glad I only bought 100 and he bought 1000 All the 308 shooters at our club who shoot HBC's run similar loads aside from the two who run tight barrels, myself being one of them. We drop our load back 0.5gr which seems to work better for some reason.

Hopefully I can source some newer ones this weekend and do a comparision myself. Im willing to do a quick report up on it if I can get some.