bullets.

[bruce moulds]

a friend of mine recently started weighing loaded rounds as part of a trial to reduce vertical.
he and i both weigh our brass and powder, so i thought it would also be interesting to weigh my rounds.
25 of mine had an extreme spread of + or - 0.2 grains, within spec for the variation in brass weight of that lot.
all of john's ammo was within spec for his brass weights, except for one round which was a wopping 3 gn heavier than average.
this suggests that a bullet was overweight, and 3 gn in 155 is unacceptable in my opinion.
while i have detected slight weight variations in sierra bullets, and bigger ones in hornady, i have never in many years of weighing bullets found one that bad.
if i were shooting a 308 today i would be forced to consider the new sierra palma bullet as my main bullet.
bruce moulds.

[mike H]

a friend of mine recently started weighing loaded rounds as part of a trial to reduce vertical.
he and i both weigh our brass and powder, so i thought it would also be interesting to weigh my rounds.
25 of mine had an extreme spread of + or - 0.2 grains, within spec for the variation in brass weight of that lot.
all of john's ammo was within spec for his brass weights, except for one round which was a wopping 3 gn heavier than average.
this suggests that a bullet was overweight, and 3 gn in 155 is unacceptable in my opinion.
while i have detected slight weight variations in sierra bullets, and bigger ones in hornady, i have never in many years of weighing bullets found one that bad.
if i were shooting a 308 today i would be forced to consider the new sierra palma bullet as my main bullet.
bruce moulds.

Bruce,
This also suggests that John has mixed up his brass,or perhaps had a brain fade when loading.To be sure, it would help to pull the suspect bullet and weigh all the components again. If the bullet is overweight by three grains notify the manufacturer.
Mike.

[bruce moulds]

mike,
you don't know john.
i merely mention this in terms of where anyone could come unstuck.
bullets are made by men, and men can fail.
bruce.

[AlanF]

I remember once getting a 108gn in amongst 139gn Scenars. They were a different length of course, but not by as much as you'd expect, and I may not have noticed if not weighing them. If it had been a 139 amongst 108s then it might have been dangerous pressure-wise.

In my experience with Lapua, Sierra and Berger bullets, mainly with 6.5mm, you should measure the weight with Lapuas, and the base to ogive measurement with Sierras. The Bergers are good for both weight and base to ogive, so I just use them out of the box.

Alan

[Lynn Otto]

mainly with 6.5mm...the base to ogive measurement with Sierras.
Alan

Alan, Trev concurs with this, in the .223, the sierra weight is spot on every time (within a minor discrepancy) but the lengths are quite varied. He noted that the Nosler weight and lengths are good as well.

[bruce moulds]

alan,
i have had a berger 140 x 6.5 & a 180 x 284 without the points being formed. sort of like vld wadcutters.
these of course were obvious.
they would have had vicious expansion on varmints!
other than that, one of the main reasons i like bergers is the lack of need for batching. this could make them not quite at the price disadvantage to other brands that they initially seem. the vld bergers are however quite finicky to tune and keep in tune.
i believe the only australian bullets worth buying on the above basis are those made by ken melgaard. it would be worth building a serious rifle based on using ken's bullets.
borescope viewings suggest that there is no australian barrel currently finished to the standards of the best u.s. ones.
barrels, bullets, and bedding!
it is my current belief that at the moment, bullet technology is the weakest link in the triangle.
bruce moulds.

[Razer]

Would you expand on your comment please Bruce;
borescope viewings suggest that there is no australian barrel currently finished to the standards of the best u.s. ones.

As most of the barrels used here would be those made in US, Kreiger,etc. or NZ, Trueflite, and GB, Border and Archer, wouldn't that put Au barrels in a minority?
When you put 'finished to the standards of US', what area are you actually referring to? Internal surface, consistency of lands, twist rate,
bore diameter, steel quality, etc. and, do you rate Trueflite and Border with Au barrels?
Or, dare may I ask, are you referring to the gunsmithing, ie: the chambering, etc.?
Would appreciate your comments.
Ray.

[Chris S]

I'd like to comment on what you see through a borescope as well
and if the appearance of the bore is the be all and end all.
I've owned/own barrels by Krieger, Maddco, Lilja and Shilen (so far!)
and have a Hawkeye borescope. Kriegers, when brand new, look very scratchy, I assume because they are cut rifled. The Lilja's I've had look
like glass from new and clean up in a flash. Maddco's and Shilens and
pretty much any other button rifled barrels look about the same, mostly.
It's on target performance that really counts in the end, in my humble opinion. Never judge a book by it's cover and all that.

cheers, Chris

[AlanF]

...Kriegers, when brand new, look very scratchy, I assume because they are cut rifled...

I've recently bought my 7th Krieger, and the bore finish is noticeably improved over all previous ones. Not just bore-scope appearance but it ran in like a dream. I think they might be using a mechanised (rather than hand) lapping process.

Alan

[bruce moulds]

ray,
i refer to the internal factory finish.
i have had nothing to do with truflite, border, or archer, so cannot comment. they have a good reputation.
i have seen an oz barrel that had a finish like a millsaw file.
funnily enough, that barrel shot ok ( not brilliantly).
i have a 45 cal badger barrel on a 45/90 which is less expensive than krieger etc and has a good finish.
bruce.

[RDavies]

To those who use Berger and Sierra 6mms and 7mms, do they vary much in weight or dimensions, is it worth spending the big bucks on decent electronic scales and measuring gear?
Will a grain or two (or three) make any noticeable difference? I kind of thought a heavier bullet would be slower but have more momentum, all within reason???

[AlanF]

To those who use Berger and Sierra 6mms and 7mms, do they vary much in weight or dimensions, is it worth spending the big bucks on decent electronic scales and measuring gear?
Will a grain or two (or three) make any noticeable difference? I kind of thought a heavier bullet would be slower but have more momentum, all within reason???

Yes I agree Rod - a heavier bullet has a higher sectional density, so if it starts slower it'll probably catch up. To be honest I don't use Lapuas any more so don't weigh any projectiles, and was never really convinced it would give a noticeable advantage anyway.

But I do think base to ogive batching is worthwhile if they vary by 10 thou or more.

Alan

[Barry Davies]

Considering the base to ogive dimension.
I have seated projectiles with a 10 thou variation in base to ogive and when checked after seating ( base of case to ogive ) they measure the same.
This indicates to me that the ogive is in all probability the same shape and the base to ogive measurement does not mean a variation in ogive shape or length, it simply means that the base of some projectiles are 10 thou ( in this case ) further into the case that others.
Barry