New to F-Class - Wanting some advice

[Stevo]

Hi all,

I've been wanting to get into F-Class Open shooting for a little while now but i'm not sure where to start equipment/rifle wise.

Had been considering the following:

Rifle : Tikka T3 Varmint Stainless (Unchanged)

Caliber : .300WM

Scope: Nightforce 12-42 x 56 BR model

I had noticed a similar thread regarding F-Class standard and was wondering if this would be a good enough starting point for a newcomer for Open not standard? and whether a caldwell style front rest or a F-Class bipod would be a better choice?

Also are there any limitations in Open to the types of projectiles for use or just in standard?

Any advice/feedback would be great

Cheers,

Stevo

[IanP]

If you are looking to buy a hunting rifle that you can use for F-Open the Tikka would do the job. The 300WM driving 210 Berger VLDs would be a good ballistic choice but probably uncomfortable to shoot in comps. There is not any restriction on the projectile choice in F-Open so long as it is under 8mm and can legally be fired on the rifle range.

If you want an out the box competitive rifle then look at the Savage F-Class rifles in 6mm BR and probably better for all ranges the 6.5x284 version pushing 140gr VLDs. Look here: http://www.savagearms.com/firearms/model/12+F+CLASS Its good to know that when you wear out the barrel with the high velocity 6.5x284 loads you can then use the cases (Lapua) by expanding the necks to use in a new 7mm barrel and shooting as a very accurate 284W launching 180gr VLDs.

Scope and Caldwell or Sinclair (preferred) front rest would work well with the Savage but the front rest would need a narrow bag fitted to suit the Tikka if that is the way you want to go. Bipod on the Tikka with a 300WM would jump a fair bit between each shot, not ideal for an accurate F-Open choice.

IanP

[Stevo]

Thanks for the advice, i had looked at the savage F-class rifles but was wanting a 30-cal and settled on .300WM as it appealed to me most of the big 30's. Which then ruled the savage out as they're only short actions

I had looked at a custom rifle for it however it started to get a bit out of my current budget very quickly
Which lead me to think of the T3 varmint as i have a T3 Hunter in 25/06 that will happily shoot 3/8" @ 100m all day (providing i do my part of course). Figured if it was good enough as a starting point it'd let me get some experience up while i save up for something a bit better

Ah so bipod is a bad choice good to know

Thanks

[IanP]

Re-read my post as I added (edited) some info same time as you were replying to my initial post. It lets you know how you can use it as 7mm shooting 180gr VLDs as a 284W. Put a 7mm Krieger barrel on the Savage after you shoot the factory barrel out and you will be competitive with the best in this country!

IanP

[Stevo]

hmm now that's an interesting idea i had not thought of (the 6.5x284 then converted to 284W), would completely remove my issue of a lack of match grade brass for a 300WM....

Might have to look into that a bit,

Cheers for the update will make for some interesting reading later

[AlanF]

Stevo,

Adding to Ian's info, you'll almost certainly need some way of extending your scopes vertical adjustment, usually done by fitting a sloping Weaver/Picatinny rail, or using Burris offset rings.

Another thing to watch will be whether the throat is deep enough for the long projectiles such as 210gn - they may need to be seated well into the case.

The weight of your rifle is probably less than 4Kg? Even with a scope you'll be under half the allowed weight of 10Kg. In terms of rifle behaviour under recoil, this'll put you at a big disadvantage.

My advice generally is not to have a rifle that compromises between hunting and F-Class - it won't be much good at either. I've never seen a hunting (or tactical for that matter) rifle that can compete with purpose built F-Open rifles. On the other hand, F-Open rifles would generally be pretty hopeless for hunting.

Sorry to dash your hopes, but better to find out before too many dallars are spent.

Alan

[Stevo]

sorry alan i forgot to list a 20 MOA picatinny rail for the scope but had already thought of that.

Regarding the weight of a T3 varmint, that thought had occurred to (and worried) me, i was curious as to if there are F-Class stocks available to fit a tikka action? or by moving to that am i reaching the price range of being better off going completely custom?

Only asking as i'd prefer to be able to stick with the 300WM, call me stubborn but theres something about its ballistics i like

Thanks,

[AlanF]

Stevo,

It really depends how much you want to do F-Class (or hunting). My advice would be to take your 300 to a range, have some shots with it as is, and if the club has an F-Class rifle, ask for a shoot with that. If not you may get an offer to try someone else's. If you do that, you'll appreciate the difference I promise you. We have a new member in the same situation as you (except he has a 300WSM A-Bolt). His hunting rifle went okay at 300 yds, but once we gave him a taste of the club 6BR and my 7 Shehane at longer ranges he quickly decided to get an F-Open rifle.

But if you just want to have a play, and treat F-Class as practice for hunting, then you'll probably stick with the Tikka.

Alan

[Stevo]

EDIT:
I guess the more i think about this your original advice seems more and more likely what i should/will do.

If you want an out the box competitive rifle then look at the Savage F-Class rifles in 6mm BR and probably better for all ranges the 6.5x284 version pushing 140gr VLDs. Look here: http://www.savagearms.com/firearms/model/12+F+CLASS Its good to know that when you wear out the barrel with the high velocity 6.5x284 loads you can then use the cases (Lapua) by expanding the necks to use in a new 7mm barrel and shooting as a very accurate 284W launching 180gr VLDs.

Lapua Brass is basically a given to use correct?
Projectiles - 140gn VLDs, anything else worth checking out? anyone use the lapua 139gn scenars? or possibly 142gn Sierra HPBT matchking?
As for powder, i'm currently using ADI powders mostly 2209, sufficient? or is there something preferable?

Sorry for all the questions, but the help is very much appreciated

[AlanF]

Stevo,

You'll be okay with 2209 and Berger 140s in a 6.5-284. I've actually had most success with SMK 142s but have done okay at times with the Bergers and Lapua Scenars. Alternatives to 2209 are 2213SC and VV N165 (expensive but cooler burning). Lapua brass is the go, although Ian's suggestion of using it in a 6.5 then expanding to 284 might be problematic unless it is annealed before expanding.

There's plenty of info around the net on the 6.5-284, including on 6mmBR.com.

Alan

[IanP]

Steve, I use the 139gr Scenars but point them up to increase their BC and have put a number of 3 shot groups thru the same hole at 100m. If your not pointing then follow Alan's advice and use the the 140-142gr projectiles.

The team USA shot the 6.5x284 in last years world F-Open championships and did very well. The 7mm calibres with 180gr projectiles did most of the winning.

The Lapua brass 6.5x284 is what most of us use for our 284W or 284 Shehane cases, we all expand them up from new brass. Alan is also correct about the need to anneal used brass before expanding up to 284W. I anneal my brass cases after every 5 firings with a bernzamatic propane torch from Bunnings.

There is only a very small ballistic advantage using a 300WM with 210gr projectiles and it involves launching them at higher velocities than the 284W with the 180gr VLDs. The 300WM uses more powder, needs heavier projectiles launched at higher velocities, has increased barrel wear and has a good deal more recoil to contend with in competitions. I dont think it will offer any advantage to you and would be a bear to shoot in a little Tikka.

If you want to shoot 30cal in F-Open then the 300WSM is the better choice. It can launch the 210gr VLDs at 2900fps (300WM good for 3000+fps) from a more efficient case with less recoil. My advice would still be to get the Savage in 6.5x284 if you are serious about F-Open and upgrade to a 7mm barrel later.

It would even be possible to use the Savage as a switch barrel and use the 6.5x284 for the ranges out to 600m and screw on the 7mm barrel and use the 284W for long range.

There is a 3 part article on safclass.com.au that may be of interest to you, all about the pursuit of the elusive ballistic advantage. It also has useful info on getting on target at long range.
Look Here: http://www.safclass.com.au/BallisticBasics.html

IanP

[AlanF]

There is a 3 part article on safclass.com.au that may be of interest to you, all about the pursuit of the elusive ballistic advantage. It also has useful info on getting on target at long range.
Look Here: http://www.safclass.com.au/BallisticBasics.html

IanP

Well done with that Ian. Your website is becoming a very useful reference for F-Class.

Alan

[bobped]

New Class of F Class,

I think we are going to have to invent a new classification or division in F Class in some sort of "Hunter" or Light Rifle Class.

I hear so many stories of people bringing their sporter type rifles to the range and then having others telling them their rifle won't be good enough, and they would be better getting some sort of specialised target rifle.

Most of these people then give up and go off to the SSAA.

Bob

[Woody_rod]

New Class of F Class,

I think we are going to have to invent a new classification or division in F Class in some sort of "Hunter" or Light Rifle Class.

I hear so many stories of people bringing their sporter type rifles to the range and then having others telling them their rifle won't be good enough, and they would be better getting some sort of specialised target rifle.

Most of these people then give up and go off to the SSAA.

Bob

Amen. I was talking to one of our customers yesterday about this exact thing. The importance of the subject is brought home by the fact that this guy intends using the rifle to cross from SSAA disciplines into NRAA in F Open. He knows he wont be at the top, but there is no reason with some effort, he wont do ok.

It is a matter of priorities. Number one is getting members for our sport, two is into F Class standard (for example) and three is work for businesses that support our sport.

[BATattack]

hi stevo!

listen to alan and ian they know what theyr on about

the savage has a good trigger and a stock that is shaped correctly for f class. they are easy to get 20MOA taperd rails for and other "hot rod" goodies for if you wish.

they are designed to shoot f class straight out of the box.

6.5x284 is a great caliber that has a ton of load data avalible and there are lots of very high quality 6.5mm target bullets aswell. alan has shot the 6.5x284 for many years and has a swag of wins to show for it.

if you have your heart set on a 300WM at the moment see if you can borrow one for a day to take to the range. 24 or 36 accuratly aimed shots, laying prone off they ground while trying to get your gun back on target, after getting your eyes full of dirt from the muzzle blast while learning how to read the wind at the same time genrally doesnt result in a winning score. a fully custom 300WM on a tracker style stock weighted to 9.999kg and with top of the line front and rear rests it is "managable" but that can happen in the future.

i go to the range to enjoy the day not tollerate it.

hope you get out there soon and start having fun!