First Timer

[Gunnie]

Hi one and all,

have recently decided to have a crack at F-class. Attended a 303 memorial shoot at a local clubs range and had a ball. The members were friendly and made myself and my shooting mate very welcome. So figured seeing as I have a rifle in the safe which should fit already and another one on the way, why not!

At present I have a Savage LE-10FP Tac Elite in 308W fitted with a SS10x42 sniper mil-dot scope & Harris bipod. I reload my own rounds using Nosler 168gn BTHP's in Lapua brass over about 43gns of AR2208. This load and rifle will put 3 rounds into 11mm @ 100M if I do my part. It is the earlier version with the standard heavy as a truck axle spring trigger. But I am considering replacing it with a Rifle Basix No2. The stock is OK but would probably benefit from some stiffening of the fore-end.

The other rifle is another Savage LE-10FP .223Remington, but the later model with the Accu-trigger. It is also fitted with a Choate stock and will have a Versapod fitted. I have organised for a Warne 20MAO picatinny rail to be fitted but am still debating over a scope.

I have been looking at the Falcon Optics Menace scopes, with a view to either the 4-14x44 FFP model or the fixed power 10x42Menace. Not really sure which will the better one of the two. Would dearly love a Leupold but have to watch the finances as I have another rifle to pay for yet!

Was recommended to look at the Bushnell 3200 Elite Tac but not sure about it. Can pick up a near new 4-14x44 menace fitted with Badger Ord rings but am not set on which scope yet.

I will reload for this rifle also but only once I have run the barrel in and run out of the quantity of Winchester factory Premium A 69gn BTHP rounds. Then I will be working with Norma batched cases and AR2206H most likely. Was considering the Hornady 75gn A-Max pills but apparently the rifle has too slow a twist at 1-in-9, I think. So not certain what to use or whether I should just stick with 69gners.

Anyway, that is what I have to work with. Any advice, reload tips etc is greatly appreciated and will be relished. Cheers

[Woody_rod]

Mate,

I have not personally heard of the Menace scopes, but sound like rebadged Asian scopes (please correct me if I am wrong). The Bushnell elite is supposed to be a good scope. A lot of F classers use the T series weaver scope in 24 power, fine cross hair with 1/8th minute dot. Thery are not super expensive, and are very reliable. On the other hand, I have seen all sorts of scopes used.

You did not say what caliber the second rifle was... a 6mm of some sort, like a 243??? If so, it will be fine in 1-9 twist, but you will have to try it and see what happens - no other way of knowing.

Get yourself a copy of the Standard Shooting Rules (SSR's) from the NRAA website (www dot nraa dot com dot au), and read up on reloading. It is pretty restrictive if you intend shooting F class standard (the SSRs explain this).

[Gunnie]

Rod,

thanks for the heads up. Will download a copy of the rules and have a read.
The Menace scopes are made by a UK based company. They source their glass from a Japanese company to their specs. The initial buildup is done in China and the final and quality assurance is done in the UK.

The scopes rate for around the $400US, the company doesn't sell retail - yet, and will be imported by parabellum imports here in Australia. I have had a look at their 4-18x56 model and it is a very sound looking unit. Sniper Central website gives the scopes a good rap for a tac style scope in the $400-600 range.

The 4-14x44Front Focal Plane model is rated as a better unit than the larger version. Their fixed power model also rates very well. Though not in the league of leupold Mk4's etc the Menace range are very good value for money.

Have edited my original post. The second rifle is in 223. It is replacing my ageing Remington Model 788, also in 223. I have several other 224 cal centrefires for hunting use so I could relegate the 223 to a target use instead.

Cheers

[GM]

Hi Gunnie, my son runs a 1:9 twist with the 69 grainer back to 600/700 yards with a fair bit of success.
You can be competitive with a good handload.
You can shoot that barrel out and swap to a faster twist later to run the 80grainers.
Best of luck with it,
GM

[Gunnie]

Thanks for the welcome and info GM.
Its looking like I'm stuck with the 69gn'ers at present. Not to worry can always re-barrel as you said. Though with the number of times I'm likely to get to the range each year, that could be a long way down the track.

Still any time on a range busting caps is beter than a day at work eh?

[mike H]

Hello Gunnie,
Welcome to F/class. For a start, I would reccomend that you use the .308 Savage, since it has a scope and bi-pod. All you need extra is a back sand bag. For F/standard, you will need to load your ammo with 155 grain projectiles, as supplied by various state rifle associations, also ADI powders. See rule book.

Why I say go with the .308 is you seem to be a bit lost in scope choice, for the .223. Since most F/classer`s use fixed 16 or 20 power, or variables 6 to 24 or 8 to 32 power, it may be an idea to hold off for a while and do a bit of study. Try and get to as many shoots as you can, to see what is being used.
Mike.

[bennf]

Yeh Gunnie
The best bet is to hold off with the 223 scope and see what the locals are using. Not all scopes are created equal in F class.
I have just bought a 12-42 Nightforce but your talking $1500 before that I was using a $750 Nikko Sterlilng 10 - 50 x60 power target scope and loved the thing.
I shoot 223 but always use the 80grn SMK's the amax are not alowed in comp but must clubs allow them inday to day shoots.

Good luck and good shooting.

Benn

[Gunnie]

Thanks for the advice.
I have a couple of scopes in the safe which I could use - a Nikko Targetmaster 8-32x44 AO and a Nikko Platinum 6-24x40 side focus. I suppose either would do the job but I was advised by one F-class shooter to invest in a scope with target /tactical style turrets to enable easy range sight adjustments.

I'll out whichever of the two is the better on the rifle and see what happens. Have to drag the scopes out and have a look.

[Grant]

I run a BSA contender 6-24 * 40 scope on my 7.62 and find it absolutely great

[AlanF]

Thanks for the advice.
I have a couple of scopes in the safe which I could use - a Nikko Targetmaster 8-32x44 AO and a Nikko Platinum 6-24x40 side focus. I suppose either would do the job but I was advised by one F-class shooter to invest in a scope with target /tactical style turrets to enable easy range sight adjustments...

Gunnie,

The main requirement for turrets is to have finger-adjustable knobs - height is handy but not compulsory. If they have knobs, the Nikko scopes will be fine except you will need a sloping rail of approx 20MOA because of the limited vertical adjustment in these 25mm tube scopes. The most popular Nikkos are the 30mm tube models.

Hope you enjoy F-Class.

Alan

[bennf]

Good point Alan
Gunnie a 20 MOA rail is a must if you want to get back to the 1000yrd mount.
I started with a Nikko and shot well for a nu,ber of years. You would be doing the right thing sitting back and checking the gear everyone else is using and ask to have a go with it.

Good luck on the range


Benn

[Gunnie]

Thanks for that guys.
I've had a Warne 20MOA picatinny rail fitted but I'll have to wait and see how things go with the rifle and if it's capable of pushing the 800M ranges at the Ripley club.

Will hold off until I get a good feel for the rifle and shooting FS. Cheers

[Simon C]

That rifle should be capable of shooting 1000yds given the setup you describe using the 168's. Although remember that u will need to shoot the 155's in order to shoot FS. Ive seen a few of these Savage rifles do quite well in FS using the 155 sierras.

[Woody_rod]

Our club 223 is used exclusively in FS - it is an Omark. We use a BSA 6-24 x 40 scope on it. The rifle has now had over 1200 rounds through it, and no problems at all with the scope. The much bigger recoil of the 308 may give a different outcome though.

With your bullet choice Gunny, if you intend shooting in FS, try to stick to the 155gr requirement as they will fly a lot different than the 165s, particularly at long ranges.

[Gunnie]

Thanks guys,

I'll work through the last of my 168gn reloads before I make a start with 155gn loads. I did buy a couple of boes of Speer 150gn BTFMJ which I am led to believe is what the US snipers were firing through their rifles in the 60's & 70's. Not sure if the scope is sitting on a picatinny rail, it's been that long since I've had the old girl out of the safe! Will have to check that one.

The 223 definitely has a Warne 20MOA rail fitted and I'll put the Platinum Nighteater scope on to start with. Once I see how things are going with 69gn loads I'll look to a better scope.

The Falcom Menace might be OK but if finances work out I'll plug for a Nightforce or Leupold.

So tell me, with the 69gn SMK's am I best suited with AR2208 instead of the 2206 that I have been using in my 55gn reloads?