Pics of this weeks shoot. .308 and 6XC plus a few toys.

[Sam Walker]

Barry I disagree - we shouldn't encourage the tabloid fear mongering efforts by censoring everything into some sort of PC fairytale. The pics of those rifles should only be of concern because the government deems us untrustworthy to have them - yet we should trust the government to have them ? Who are they going to be used against....
Not my cup of tea but just because those rifles look different to what the typical F Class shooter uses isn't a good reason to censor them. Take that logic a few more steps and the ability to hit a target at several hundred metres would be a good enough reason to ban sporting use of CF rifles.

[DannyS]

I think you sumed it up pretty well Aubrey, you just don't get it.

[Aubrey]

I think you sumed it up pretty well Aubrey, you just don't get it.

Really? So why don't you spell it out for us dumb guys?

[AlanF]

As far as I'm concerned, the photos can stay. Its been made quite clear that some (most?) of the rifles are not suitable for F-Class. Some F-Class shooters will find them interesting, others won't. I think the best approach is to respect the other viewpoint, and stick together against the anti-gun lobby.

Alan

PS Barry - did you see the photo of James Corbett after his Nationals win? He's wearing camo .

[Barry Davies]

James always was ( and still is ) an unobtrusive person --always Mr modest.
Barry

[DannyS]

Aubrey,

Back in the 1980s ex-military semi-autos were readily available in Aust as was bulk 7.62x39 ammo, these firearms had no real sporting purpose, however, when everything went pear shaped, all semi autos got thrown into the same basket, genuine sporting semi autos like ruger. 22s and browning A5s were taken from us.

Many shooters I knew had already forecasted that it would happen due to the public perception of owners of ex military semi autos as being Rambos. Please note that I'm not calling everyone that owned one a rambo. I know a few collectors that had them and they were and are fine people, however, I sure there was also a small group of owners that were not.

As far as rifles such as 50 cals are concerned, I personally can see no legimate sporting purpose in them (bolt action or semi auto). They can't be called a hunting rifle and as far as target shooting is concerned the number of ranges on which they can be used is very limited.

I also understand that many target rifle and f class shooters don't like military looking firearms regardless of calibre.

It is a matter of public perception hence why we don't favour camo clothing either, even if James does.

Yes, as firearm owners, we should all stick together, however, why should those that want firearms that push the boundaries of acceptability expect that more conservative among us should support them, when ultimately it could spell the demise of our sport.

Cheers

Danny

[Barry Davies]

Obviously I have upset some people, however public perception is what it is and it's here to stay. Public education is the answer. Education that rifles like those shown are legal and therefore acceptable, but until such time as that happens we are at the mercy of those who do not like us. Public awareness is the answer. I can only speak about happenings here in Vic. and I would say again, at the probability of upsetting some, that public awareness of what we are about is practically nil -- and for that I put the blame squarely on the organization(s) for failing to do generally what their charter states.
It may surprise some ( particularly city folk ) to learn that the population in general are interested in things other that football.
I agree with the sentiments of some that we should not stay hidden but at the same time I see very little ( none ) being done by those responsible to promote this sport and rid the public of those nasty thoughts.
I'v heard all the excuses -- does'nt gell. Get off your backsides and promote our sport thereby reducing gradually the numbers of people who see us as Rambos ( in camo. You said it Alan not me ) Then I may well not object to the image of us that those rifles portray.
Barry

[Aubrey]

why should those that want firearms that push the boundaries of acceptability expect that more conservative among us should support them, when ultimately it could spell the demise of our sport

What boundaries of acceptability? Set by whom? This is just your personal opinion that you are trying to impose on others, and you have no right nor authority to do so.

You should be fighting for the right of every other shooter to choose any legal firearm and shoot it whenever they can, whether you would do so or not.

Like I said before, stop cringing at the possibility of criticism by the left wing, they will do so anyway regardless of what, where and how you shoot, you will never satisfy them. Any sign of weakness is pounced upon and exploited, all you are doing is dividing and weakening our sport.

The demise of our sport started with the loss of the semi autos because of attitudes like this - appeasement, weakness and backstabbing to save oneself instead of the sport as a whole.

[AlanF]

Danny,

Your post is addressed to Aubrey, but seems to be responding to mine?

I am passionate about F-Class - I gather you are too. We tend to have more emphasis on the skills of target shooting than on the equipment we use. I personally have a "get the job done" attitude towards my gear. We are fortunate that what we want to do with guns involves using single shot rifles making small holes in paper. If the general public fully understood it they would realise that it represents little more threat to society than the game of golf (some golf "widows" would say that's considerable).

But let's say we as a group abandon support for those classes of shooting and equipment that are less palatable to the public than ours, won't we be actually shooting ourselves in the foot? Because if we allow the anti-gun lobby to continue to "pick off" those categories which have least public support, it won't be too long before its our turn. Their avowed aim is not to stop until there are no privately owned firearms.

So I think its in our interests to respect the right of military style shooting enthusiasts to enjoy their sport - and I don't think its entirely fair for us to say that our shooting sport should be embraced by the public, whereas another should be condemned.

Barry,

Maybe those camo strides were on special at Aussie Disposals

Alan

[fclass556]

Alan, Wise words and absolutely correct.

[bartman007]

Getting back on track.

Thanks for the post Norm. Looks like you guys had a lot of fun. Some tasty looking bits of gear on the mound.

While these guys had some great gear, lets get down to business, what size groups were they able to achieve?

Can a 50 cal tack drive, or do you simply put big holes in the paper

Someone from Rosedale pointed out that bigger is not always better. I think in this case he may be wrong Those bigger toys look like a lot of FUN

[Woody_rod]

If it were raised: on a statistical basis it is better to give everyone firearms and remove their drivers license. There are thousands killed and maimed for life in vehicles, but you dont hear the same outrage.

It is PC shit that is wasting valuable oxygen.

[bobeager]

Isn't ironic that "half" the population are outraged by what they see in US action movies and video games- hence anti-gun, BUT the other "half" just love this stuff. You should have seen the crowds of young blokes (and girls) drooling over all the "black rifles" and other "Tacticool" stuff at the sydney SHOT Show last week. Go figure!

In fact there was a "comic book" convention in the hall next to the SHOT show, and there were all the young people dressed up in superhero kit, some of the carrying full size replica AK47 and M16's etc.

[DannyS]

G'day Alan,

My post was meant for Aubrey, he asked for an explanation and I gave him one. I knew he would fire back with both barrels, nothing like a bit of healthy discussion.

Re his comment that I had no right to express my personal view, well I did mention in my post that it was my personal view and surely we are still allowed to express our personal view in this country.

I have always supported the right of legal firearm owners to own and use firearms whatever their type, however that doesn't mean that I like or approve of some types.

Those that know me well, will remember that I was the first president of the Hamilton Branch of the SSAA. That I chaired a public meeting to protest at the firearm laws following Port Arthur and that I walked with many others in the Protest March in Melb.

I was also the Captain of the Hamilton Rifle Club when we broke away from the VRA for a few years because we were not allowed to shoot scoped rifles alongside SSAA members. Yes, we were shooting belly benchrest way before the term F Class was devised.

So yes, Aubrey, I do have backbone.

I'm sure Norm and the guys had a great time and good luck to them, however, my view (yes I'm expressing my own personal opinion) is that we should stick to F Class issues on this site.

Cheers

Danny

[johnk]

Didn't realise that there were states where the 50 BMG was legal. It ain't in Queensland.