PRS IS COMING , WE HAVE TO EVOLVE !

We want to hear what your club is doing to bring in new members. Tell us what works, and give credit to those who are making the effort.

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KHGS
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Re: PRS IS COMING , WE HAVE TO EVOLVE !

#76 Postby KHGS » Sat Mar 10, 2018 7:46 pm

jasmay wrote:Keith, I'd just like to add, evolving doesn't mean we have to tear apart our sport, it just means we need to find a way to be more inclusive. One would think the older generation would strive for this, not the younger.

I think your approach to the idea of evolution is wrong.


So what context would be right then? My understanding of "evolution" is change! Change is fine when it benefits the majority, but if it only benefits a minority it is not a good thing. Insofar as inclusivity, I have addressed this elsewhere in this thread. Furthering our sport is not up to the older or younger members, it is up to all members! Having rules & observing them is an important part of furthering our sport. With this in mind I think your approach to this issue is wrong. It seems to me we are not going to find any common ground, so I think we should agree to disagree!!
Keith H.

KHGS
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Re: PRS IS COMING , WE HAVE TO EVOLVE !

#77 Postby KHGS » Sat Mar 10, 2018 7:58 pm

Pete wrote:Then it would NOT be another discipline would it.....
So your welcoming attitude Keith, is kind of a meaningless statement.
Though I am sure your smile alone, is worth more than the price of admission!
Thankfully we have some positives returning to this thread!


Pete I have already addressed the "discipline" part of the discussion elsewhere in this thread.
I really do not care if you think my "welcoming attitude" is meaningless.....whatever that means!
Perhaps you should realise that not everyone will agree with you on all issues, I have the right to disagree with you, just as you have the right to disagree with me, but let's agree to disagree without malice.
Keith H.

Kakaduthunder
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Re: PRS IS COMING , WE HAVE TO EVOLVE !

#78 Postby Kakaduthunder » Sat Mar 10, 2018 10:43 pm

As an avid prs shooter and occasional f class shooter I would like to throw my 2 cents in.

I think a few points have gone astray in this conversation. And I will try to add some prospective as someone who is currently organising prs matches and trying to integrate with our local NRA range.

Firstly muzzle brakes. No one wants to shoot next to a muzzle brake Period. When myself and others from the prs crowd want to participate in long range practice (ie fclass) we respect the rules and take our brakes off. Really it’s not that hard. 1 minute to remove and a quick re-zero. The previous points about muzzle brakes and calling shots are a mute point. When you shoot fclass you have sighting markers or electronic targets so you don’t need to call your shots. At a known distance if you can’t get your shots on a target that large you are going to struggle with PRS!

The point is we don’t want to shoot exclusively f class but we would love to be able to use the extended ranges afforded at NRA clubs. It is my understanding that most ranges have a free day, or at least part of a day, that could be used to run a PRS style match. That way no one is upsetting the concentration of the full bore and fclass shooters. Prs matches are typically run one or two shooters at a time with good separation so muzzle brakes arn’t an issue.

Targets. We don’t want to shoot fclass and full bore targets. Ideally we would shoot steel. This is a problem at a lot of ranges as the template is not set up/ licensed for it. However most NRA ranges were set up exclusively to shoot paper targets so the question of steel never came up. Changes could be made in some circumstances but they would have to come from within the clubs.

From someone who is essentially on the outside looking in, my opinion is we don’t want to change a single thing about f class full bore as some have suggested in previous posts. We don’t want to shoot besides someone with a braked rifle. We would love the opertunity to use the excellent facilities that exist at your ranges and run a new form of competition in parallel, not in competition.

There are other major issues like affiliations and insurances that need to be resolved. However nothing is insurmountable with the right support in the right places.

Summing up, anything that increases the number of people participating in shooting sports is a good thing for all involved. Change takes time and effort but this conversation is a good start.

John S

KHGS
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Re: PRS IS COMING , WE HAVE TO EVOLVE !

#79 Postby KHGS » Sun Mar 11, 2018 8:35 am

Kakaduthunder wrote:As an avid prs shooter and occasional f class shooter I would like to throw my 2 cents in.

I think a few points have gone astray in this conversation. And I will try to add some prospective as someone who is currently organising prs matches and trying to integrate with our local NRA range.

Firstly muzzle brakes. No one wants to shoot next to a muzzle brake Period. When myself and others from the prs crowd want to participate in long range practice (ie fclass) we respect the rules and take our brakes off. Really it’s not that hard. 1 minute to remove and a quick re-zero. The previous points about muzzle brakes and calling shots are a mute point. When you shoot fclass you have sighting markers or electronic targets so you don’t need to call your shots. At a known distance if you can’t get your shots on a target that large you are going to struggle with PRS!

The point is we don’t want to shoot exclusively f class but we would love to be able to use the extended ranges afforded at NRA clubs. It is my understanding that most ranges have a free day, or at least part of a day, that could be used to run a PRS style match. That way no one is upsetting the concentration of the full bore and fclass shooters. Prs matches are typically run one or two shooters at a time with good separation so muzzle brakes arn’t an issue.

Targets. We don’t want to shoot fclass and full bore targets. Ideally we would shoot steel. This is a problem at a lot of ranges as the template is not set up/ licensed for it. However most NRA ranges were set up exclusively to shoot paper targets so the question of steel never came up. Changes could be made in some circumstances but they would have to come from within the clubs.

From someone who is essentially on the outside looking in, my opinion is we don’t want to change a single thing about f class full bore as some have suggested in previous posts. We don’t want to shoot besides someone with a braked rifle. We would love the opertunity to use the excellent facilities that exist at your ranges and run a new form of competition in parallel, not in competition.

There are other major issues like affiliations and insurances that need to be resolved. However nothing is insurmountable with the right support in the right places.

Summing up, anything that increases the number of people participating in shooting sports is a good thing for all involved. Change takes time and effort but this conversation is a good start.

John S

John, your comments are pretty much what I have been saying right throughout this thread =D> =D> =D> =D> =D>
Keith H.

jasmay
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Re: PRS IS COMING , WE HAVE TO EVOLVE !

#80 Postby jasmay » Sun Mar 11, 2018 8:50 am

And, what I was trying to get across to you Keith, sorry I wasn't able....

Your Context question: In the context that we need to grow membership urgently, evolving in a manner that makes our ranges and sport more accessible without impacting it is, I believe, crucial to making this happen. Growing membership may seem to only have a minorities interests at heart, but if you think a bit deeper, growing the membership base benefits the entire movement, not just the new comers.

Yes, having rules is important I have never said they are not, all I have been trying to get at is, do those rules leave us open to growth, none of us need to answer that question, as the answer is in a decade long decline in membership, so the question again is, how do we change to bring more people into the sport & onto our ranges.

This will be my last post on this thread as I have started a broader conversation on the decline in membership in the General section.

Regards,
Jase....

GSells
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Re: PRS IS COMING , WE HAVE TO EVOLVE !

#81 Postby GSells » Sun Mar 11, 2018 9:10 am

Just to wrap this up , thank you everyone for your good thoughts and discussions!
Some really good input . Hopefully someone is listening and small changes in rules that aids growth and keeps everyone happy . Myself , I believe a production feeder class that has been put up on a thread before by Mr Aarons would be good !
Regards Graham Sells .

KHGS
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Re: PRS IS COMING , WE HAVE TO EVOLVE !

#82 Postby KHGS » Sun Mar 11, 2018 3:45 pm

GSells wrote:Just to wrap this up , thank you everyone for your good thoughts and discussions!
Some really good input . Hopefully someone is listening and small changes in rules that aids growth and keeps everyone happy . Myself , I believe a production feeder class that has been put up on a thread before by Mr Aarons would be good !
Regards Graham Sells .

You still don't get it do you? Nothing needed to be changed as I have already explained, have you not read my posts?? Neither side needs to evolve, both sides just need to follow the existing rules & continue to co-exist as they do now. None of this thread has had anything to do with increasing membership, it's been about Target Rifle/F-Class changing to suit PRS who don't want or need the "change" anyway!!! It seems to me Graham that this is not the first time you have charged off on a "tangent" ! Charging into things without thought & some research will often create unintended animosity. You are right Graham, this thread should be wrapped up.
Keith H.

!Peter!
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Re: PRS IS COMING , WE HAVE TO EVOLVE !

#83 Postby !Peter! » Sun Mar 11, 2018 4:38 pm

Perhaps the word evolve should be co-exist.

Image

GSells
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Re: PRS IS COMING , WE HAVE TO EVOLVE !

#84 Postby GSells » Sun Mar 11, 2018 5:58 pm

KHGS wrote:
GSells wrote:Just to wrap this up , thank you everyone for your good thoughts and discussions!
Some really good input . Hopefully someone is listening and small changes in rules that aids growth and keeps everyone happy . Myself , I believe a production feeder class that has been put up on a thread before by Mr Aarons would be good !
Regards Graham Sells .

You still don't get it do you? Nothing needed to be changed as I have already explained, have you not read my posts?? Neither side needs to evolve, both sides just need to follow the existing rules & continue to co-exist as they do now. None of this thread has had anything to do with increasing membership, it's been about Target Rifle/F-Class changing to suit PRS who don't want or need the "change" anyway!!! It seems to me Graham that this is not the first time you have charged off on a "tangent" ! Charging into things without thought & some research will often create unintended animosity. You are right Graham, this thread should be wrapped up.
Keith H.

Kieth out of repsrct , thanks for the contructive criticism, I’ll try and remember that for next time , I charge off on another tangent ! :D
Regards Graham.

SunnyCoast 5r
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Re: PRS IS COMING , WE HAVE TO EVOLVE !

#85 Postby SunnyCoast 5r » Sun Mar 18, 2018 10:26 pm

I have enjoyed reading the range of comments thanks Graham. Looking forward to seeing some more PRS shooters coming to NRAA ranges to enjoy the challenge of long range shooting: surely we have more in common than we realise...

And can’t wait to have a crack at PRS! Might help my wind reading too.

Simon C
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Re: PRS IS COMING , WE HAVE TO EVOLVE !

#86 Postby Simon C » Mon Mar 19, 2018 7:48 am

Is this shot in SA? I'd be keen to have a look as I have a suitable rifle
"Aim small, miss small"

Simon

GSells
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Re: PRS IS COMING , WE HAVE TO EVOLVE !

#87 Postby GSells » Mon Mar 19, 2018 6:53 pm

SunnyCoast 5r wrote:I have enjoyed reading the range of comments thanks Graham. Looking forward to seeing some more PRS shooters coming to NRAA ranges to enjoy the challenge of long range shooting: surely we have more in common than we realise...

And can’t wait to have a crack at PRS! Might help my wind reading too.

As it turns out , I should be at the next shoot Easter is the weekend before ! Make sure you have a good wind zero either 100m or 200m . Last time they had a little blow off session but by the time I go to the 100m target it was Swiss cheese .
Looking forward to shooting with u all on the full bore side in f class too!
Just remember no brakes as its a standing range order out if our control.

Simon , I don't know about S.A., get onto the prs fb site and maybe ask .
Regards Graham

SunnyCoast 5r
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Re: PRS IS COMING , WE HAVE TO EVOLVE !

#88 Postby SunnyCoast 5r » Mon Mar 19, 2018 7:53 pm

Just read that the Mildura PRS event is already full in less than 24 hours - wow that is popular!

Can’t make the April comp but will get there this year.

flatlina
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Re: PRS IS COMING , WE HAVE TO EVOLVE !

#89 Postby flatlina » Tue Mar 20, 2018 8:42 am

jasmay wrote:
KHGS wrote:.


Did you read the alarmist article about the SSAA and the fact they have amassed a multimillion dollar (freehold) land portfolio, from GCA...




Hi,

Can you enlighten me on this comment?

Regards
jb

Grizzly
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Re: PRS IS COMING , WE HAVE TO EVOLVE !

#90 Postby Grizzly » Tue Mar 20, 2018 4:49 pm

That looks like fantastic fun and in turn, fun attracts people. As for worry worts, best not to attempt solving worries before starting something new. As it has been said "build it and they will come". Ever seen a business try to solve every problem before they start up! nup. Get it rolling and smooth out the bumps as they are crossed. People love solving issues once something already has momentum, Go for it. On a BAD financial note, start saving for a new rifle and place your order with Matt !!! and another scope...... and on and on.... you'll all be in the dog box again.


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