PRS IS COMING , WE HAVE TO EVOLVE !

We want to hear what your club is doing to bring in new members. Tell us what works, and give credit to those who are making the effort.

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Wal86
Posts: 319
Joined: Sun Nov 20, 2016 5:10 pm

Re: PRS IS COMING , WE HAVE TO EVOLVE !

#61 Postby Wal86 » Sat Mar 10, 2018 7:44 am

Just out of curiosity, how many followers does PRS have in Australia?
What sort of numbers roll up to one of their championship rounds, i believe they have a circuit of some sort where they shoot for points?
Cheers

jasmay
Posts: 1291
Joined: Fri Sep 28, 2012 9:26 pm

Re: PRS IS COMING , WE HAVE TO EVOLVE !

#62 Postby jasmay » Sat Mar 10, 2018 8:24 am

Wal, at the inaugural championship shoot they had 150 turn up, the max they could cater for.

Keith, you keep saying F-Class shooters need to evolve, I don’t see why they would need to. They don’t need to do anything accept allow another group of shooters to use their range.

Where are they you ask? Well, I’d say they have given up and moved on, as, a little over 3 years ago when they were actively discussing options where they could shoot there was little support for them using our ranges. So, you’re completely correct, they don’t care anymore. But, is that a good outcome.

Perhaps, instead of discussing if we should allow another group of shooters to join
us, what we should be discussing is how we stop the decline in NRAA membership, perhaps we would get some better ideas.

Keith, I’m sorry if you’ve taken offense to anything I’ve said, just keep in mind that isn’t the intent, the intent is to find a way for NRAA and it’s state affiliations to become more inclusive and grow membership and ensure our sport of F-Class has a future, even if that means funding to ensure that future comes from new disciplines.

jasmay
Posts: 1291
Joined: Fri Sep 28, 2012 9:26 pm

Re: PRS IS COMING , WE HAVE TO EVOLVE !

#63 Postby jasmay » Sat Mar 10, 2018 8:33 am

In essence Keith, no one is asking you to change what you do or how you shoot, just to allow another group of people with different guns to shoot on your range, not even next to you, just down one side, but, to perhaps assist them developing parameters to do so on our ranges.

Then, through that adoption, we may see some growth in numbers within our ranks which will ensure the future of our own sport.

That’s not a bad thing is it?

Is it really impossible for us to do that?

PRS shooters have given up asking us because of the break situation resulting in a resounding and unwelcoming NO. Even after trying to talk about ways so they don’t impact other people
On the range. Heck, on most ranges the could potentially even shoot on other days if supported correctly to do so.

So again, I think the conversation we are having is the wrong one, it should be, how do we grow our numbers.

Audax
Posts: 38
Joined: Wed Sep 27, 2017 8:48 am

Re: PRS IS COMING , WE HAVE TO EVOLVE !

#64 Postby Audax » Sat Mar 10, 2018 8:37 am

There are many out there that also have muzzle breaks on their rifles...that would solve the dust and debris problem.....!

Wal86
Posts: 319
Joined: Sun Nov 20, 2016 5:10 pm

Re: PRS IS COMING , WE HAVE TO EVOLVE !

#65 Postby Wal86 » Sat Mar 10, 2018 9:02 am

I think the NRAA should be inclusive of PRS shooters and allow them to become members and using our ranges, just like long range BR shooters... At the end of the day we all love long range shooting..
The NRAA is only as strong as its supporting base..(members)
I don't believe that PRS shooters want to shoot Fclass (that's fine), but if they did and like all discipline there are rules to adhere too...
I also believe that there are alot of ranges that are not utilised to there potential, this reflects/limits clubs incomes and infrastructure/facilities and also potential sponsorship..

Without members/infrastructure we are easy targets to be rid of.
Cheers
Last edited by Wal86 on Sat Mar 10, 2018 9:32 am, edited 3 times in total.

GSells
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Joined: Sun Aug 13, 2017 11:04 pm
Location: Qld

Re: PRS IS COMING , WE HAVE TO EVOLVE !

#66 Postby GSells » Sat Mar 10, 2018 9:05 am

Keith , I agree with you , one does have to stick to the rules . If we could have practical rifle class, that is just at club level or the odd open prize meet. With mitigation of cal limits so no one is shooting a .300 rum braked next to the mainstream shooters . And measures to combat the effect of muzzle brakes , eg bring your own baffling . Bi pod only and rear sand bag shot on a 5 ring target same as TR. Then we would have a great feeder class . Once they are getting all v’s , time to move to a dedicated f class rifle and choose between, ftr , f standard or f open .

I believe there have been discussions about this class before at just club level?
It would be great if NRAA could lead the way and give us the rules to do this . And to some extent they are .

Pete
Posts: 69
Joined: Tue Sep 09, 2014 9:01 pm
Location: Penrith

Re: PRS IS COMING , WE HAVE TO EVOLVE !

#67 Postby Pete » Sat Mar 10, 2018 9:21 am

Wal86 wrote:Just out of curiosity, how many followers does PRS have in Australia?
What sort of numbers roll up to one of their championship rounds, i believe they have a circuit of some sort where they shoot for points?
Cheers


Wal there is a match in Vic this Sunday, limited to 48 spots and quite a few people ended up missing out (myself one of them).
It is a Precision Service Rifle match............

daj
Posts: 126
Joined: Tue Sep 06, 2005 8:59 am
Location: Sunshine Coast

Re: PRS IS COMING , WE HAVE TO EVOLVE !

#68 Postby daj » Sat Mar 10, 2018 10:11 am

jasmay wrote:.........PRS shooters have given up asking us because of the break situation resulting in a resounding and unwelcoming NO.............

Case in point: NARC is a convenient 15 min drive from where I live. I have been shooting FC there since 2005 and could not hope for a better bunch of friends. However, sadly, I will not be renewing my membership this year because the club is strictly FC/TR. Clubs that accommodate PRS style shooting (Military Rifle Clubs, SSAA, PRS) are from 1hr to 5hr's drive away so my NARC membership fees and canteen/armory spending will now help offset the increased travelling expenses.
Would I rather stay shooting at NARC? ABSOLUTELY!!!

Barry Davies
Posts: 1383
Joined: Tue Aug 24, 2010 12:11 pm

Re: PRS IS COMING , WE HAVE TO EVOLVE !

#69 Postby Barry Davies » Sat Mar 10, 2018 10:41 am

Pete wrote:
Wal86 wrote:Just out of curiosity, how many followers does PRS have in Australia?
What sort of numbers roll up to one of their championship rounds, i believe they have a circuit of some sort where they shoot for points?
Cheers


Wal there is a match in Vic this Sunday, limited to 48 spots and quite a few people ended up missing out (myself one of them).
It is a Precision Service Rifle match............


Hardly satisfactory if the entry is limited to specific numbers.( or specific persons )
Barry

KHGS
Posts: 933
Joined: Thu Oct 20, 2005 12:46 am
Location: Cowra NSW

Re: PRS IS COMING , WE HAVE TO EVOLVE !

#70 Postby KHGS » Sat Mar 10, 2018 11:39 am

jasmay wrote:Wal, at the inaugural championship shoot they had 150 turn up, the max they could cater for.

Keith, you keep saying F-Class shooters need to evolve, I don’t see why they would need to. They don’t need to do anything accept allow another group of shooters to use their range.

Where are they you ask? Well, I’d say they have given up and moved on, as, a little over 3 years ago when they were actively discussing options where they could shoot there was little support for them using our ranges. So, you’re completely correct, they don’t care anymore. But, is that a good outcome.

Perhaps, instead of discussing if we should allow another group of shooters to join
us, what we should be discussing is how we stop the decline in NRAA membership, perhaps we would get some better ideas.

Keith, I’m sorry if you’ve taken offense to anything I’ve said, just keep in mind that isn’t the intent, the intent is to find a way for NRAA and it’s state affiliations to become more inclusive and grow membership and ensure our sport of F-Class has a future, even if that means funding to ensure that future comes from new disciplines.


Jason, the heading of this thread says it all!! In case you missed that too, it states in capitals.....PRS IS COMING WE (that's us isn't it?) HAVE TO EVOLVE. I would say that is pretty clear!!!!
I think the door has always been & still is open to PRS shooters to use their rifles & join in with us (i.e. Target rifle & the F-Class disciplines) if they (and their rifles) comply with the rules of the match, just as we must comply with the rules of the match and as we would have to comply with their rules if we were to roll up to one of their shoots, pretty simple really.
A sure way to lose membership is to lose your identity and a sure way to lose your identity is to change your rules to suit some other group who MAY want to shoot in our matches every time it is PERCEIVED that one of these "groups" want to be involved with us!!!
One again I welcome those from other disciplines who want to join us & I welcome them to use their rifle so long as it complies with the rules & range standing orders. One other consideration, not all ranges are licensed to cater for positional shooting!
Keith H.

jasmay
Posts: 1291
Joined: Fri Sep 28, 2012 9:26 pm

Re: PRS IS COMING , WE HAVE TO EVOLVE !

#71 Postby jasmay » Sat Mar 10, 2018 4:07 pm

Keith, wrong place for the overall discussion clearly, I will try again elsewhere as I think the overall point of what I have been saying is getting missed.

I am not saying we should change our competitions, I am saying we need to adjust rulings that refuse braked rifles on our ranges, and find other ways to be more welcoming to other shooters, if we did this it would open us up to a plethora of new members.
Last edited by jasmay on Sat Mar 10, 2018 5:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.

bully_eye
Posts: 307
Joined: Tue Jul 26, 2005 8:45 am
Location: Wollongong

Re: PRS IS COMING , WE HAVE TO EVOLVE !

#72 Postby bully_eye » Sat Mar 10, 2018 4:18 pm

Barry Davies wrote:
Pete wrote:
Wal86 wrote:Just out of curiosity, how many followers does PRS have in Australia?
What sort of numbers roll up to one of their championship rounds, i believe they have a circuit of some sort where they shoot for points?
Cheers


Wal there is a match in Vic this Sunday, limited to 48 spots and quite a few people ended up missing out (myself one of them).
It is a Precision Service Rifle match............


Hardly satisfactory if the entry is limited to specific numbers.( or specific persons )
Barry



The Vic Match is run by one guy...with help... and 48 is the number he can run through efficiently on the day- As Dirty Harry says, “A man has to know his limitations”. No one is excluded but entry is first come first served.

Michael

Pete
Posts: 69
Joined: Tue Sep 09, 2014 9:01 pm
Location: Penrith

Re: PRS IS COMING , WE HAVE TO EVOLVE !

#73 Postby Pete » Sat Mar 10, 2018 4:52 pm

Then it would NOT be another discipline would it.....
So your welcoming attitude Keith, is kind of a meaningless statement.
Though I am sure your smile alone, is worth more than the price of admission!
Thankfully we have some positives returning to this thread!

jasmay
Posts: 1291
Joined: Fri Sep 28, 2012 9:26 pm

Re: PRS IS COMING , WE HAVE TO EVOLVE !

#74 Postby jasmay » Sat Mar 10, 2018 5:45 pm

Keith, I'd just like to add, evolving doesn't mean we have to tear apart our sport, it just means we need to find a way to be more inclusive. One would think the older generation would strive for this, not the younger.

I think your approach to the idea of evolution is wrong.

KHGS
Posts: 933
Joined: Thu Oct 20, 2005 12:46 am
Location: Cowra NSW

Re: PRS IS COMING , WE HAVE TO EVOLVE !

#75 Postby KHGS » Sat Mar 10, 2018 7:26 pm

jasmay wrote:Keith, wrong place for the overall discussion clearly, I will try again elsewhere as I think the overall point of what I have been saying is getting missed.

I am not saying we should change our competitions, I am saying we need to adjust rulings that refuse braked rifles on our ranges, and find other ways to be more welcoming to other shooters, if we did this it would open us up to a plethora of new members.


Brakes are not refused on our ranges, they are permitted where match rules allow them. example 1000yd BR light gun & those NRAA ranges where PRS is now shot, Canberra comes to mind as one such range. Following the match rules is what I have been saying all along. This thread did not start out as a discussion on increasing membership, it started out regarding Target Rifle & the F-Classes "evolving" to accommodate PRS when in fact this has already been done within the framework of their matches which is fine. The rest of the discussion has been about the use of muzzle brakes on PRS rifles in F-Class matches which is not allowed in Target Rifle & F-Class match rules.
Keith H.


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