Welcome or not

We want to hear what your club is doing to bring in new members. Tell us what works, and give credit to those who are making the effort.

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Welcome or not

#1 Postby .248WIN » Thu Jul 16, 2015 2:24 am

Good day Im new to the forum and sport. I landed on this forum today while looking for answers about ballistic programs.
I have only read two topics yet,this is the first topic that I read ,well not everything but just hear and there.My next topic was about, Photos of Rifles etc.And unluckily my thirst topic there is DTA SRS for F Class.
viewtopic.php?f=26&t=3901#p30977 well do I feel Welcome.

First It looks to me that there is a feeling that people hide behind their Forum names ,so My name is Gerhardt and my surname is .I will have a look and see If I can put that in a footnote under the page ,otherwise I will change my forum name.

I'm an ex South african so Afrikaans is my home language,so please dont give me to much on the nose for my second language spelling and wording
I have been hunting since my late teens ,never competed or, realy club or target shooter.About 18 months ago I met some blokes shooting Long range ,but they shoot with wind meters Kestrels and ballistic programs and looks like everything that's not kosher on this forum. Although I have shot out to 1000 Yard in the Army ,now that was 30 years ago it only happened between five to eight times. I think we can say I know nothing about shooting past 300 Yard .Total newbie.I didn't even know about F class

I jumped in joined a few forums in Australia and South Africa ,with all off these forums shooting let's call it Tactical long range shooting or even hunting. So this is where I start my Long range shooting.

I went hunting in Guyra and happened to land up at a gunsmith with the name Davies This is the first time I saw a F class gun Ugly as hell ,My wife even told the guy his guns is ugly ,with me trying to get her to keep her big mouth shut . According to her a gun has got a nice piece of wood and a black, or stainless piece of metal hanging of the front end .Definitely not blue and yellow and what color the rainbow can throw at you.

Sow now I have learnt about F Class ,and I'm interested to learn more.Well my gun is in the making at this time . I Joined a few more forums and drop of a couple that I just could not find myself interested in. Two names on here I recognize from another forum I'm on and that is Norm and Sedo and no they didn't told me about this forum ,or warned me against F Class. And I can say I respect both of them. If they are indeed the same people from the other forum as I know that the Norm and Sedo of that forum know a few thing of long range shooting

Well to come back to Helping F-Class to Grow

I started of looking for a range that does F Class and to my luck 80 km from me there is a range, Everybody I'm shooting with tells me forget F Class they are another breed ,and number one your gun is a no no to them.
Well a few weeks back I went to have a chat with the guys, and they al seem like 'n nice bunch. Two weeks back I went again but I left my gun at home ,this time I told them that my gun looks a bit different to theirs,and they say its no problem just join mate wee need numbers and we all shoot together and enjoy our shoot ,doesn't matter what you are shooting as you will be shooting in the open class anyway. Well I am delighted .I bought a packet of ammunition and used their club gun and enjoyed my self on the 800 yard mark for the day.

I was really impressed and glad that there is now feeling against my gun,although I was warned that I would not be welcome
Today I land on this forum to be awakened.
My wife ,one of my daughters and myself was going to join this coming weekend .I really don't know If I'm welcome.At this stage I'm definitely joining. I want to learn more about wind and mirage and everything about long range shooting. But I'll be holding back on my wife and daughters money just to see if its going to work or not. I dont want to pay three joining fees ,just to walk out a couple of months later ,and waste my money.

The biggest concern is that people will see our black guns with long magazines , well traveling to the range that gun must be in a bag ,so nobody can see it ,and I haven't seen any spectators at the range its not a Million Dollar Golf Tournament.
Last week the police has found a .45 pistol ,22 with a scope the media made it a .45 FULL AUTOMATIC and A SNIPER RIFLE FOUND

When I read this post Helping F Class grow this morning ,I was In high spirit ,But I came down with a big bang on my second topic DTA SRS for F Class.

Sorry this is an old topic and unluckily some people will now read it all again .

Regards a not to welcome feeling Long ranger or is It Lone ranger

Dark Gun


lewis reynolds
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Re: Welcome or not

#2 Postby lewis reynolds » Thu Jul 16, 2015 7:12 am

welcome gerhardt

If the rifle meets the rules i dont care what it looks like always welcome at cessnock nsw..

shooter mcreid
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Re: Welcome or not

#3 Postby shooter mcreid » Thu Jul 16, 2015 7:35 am

I'm sure you would be welcome at any range I have had the pleasure of shooting at. There seemed to be a little resistance when tactical rifle first started hitting the scene however I believe that has changed. I have seen similar rifles shooting the big comps so there should be no problems with the rules and the way it looks.

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Re: Welcome or not

#4 Postby ShaneG » Thu Jul 16, 2015 7:37 am

Welcome to the forum
There is a heap of useful info and helpful people here!
Not sure where you are situated - sounds like maybe NSW?
Anyway I can't see a shooting club in the country not welcoming a new member who has basic safety.

Not completely sure of the rules but you may need a small mod to run a rear sandbag rest instead of the monopod?
What caliber? Stout barrel so guessing weight will run you into Open (10kg total) as May caliber?

Our game is about accuracy not looks - you should see some of the homemade stocks in North Queensland! But they shoot!

All horses for courses - certainly my purpose built F/TR rifle could never be hunted with!
Too heavy and too long and unwieldy!

Same as you I started shooting F Class about 7 years ago to learn wind for the field.
I believe wherever you go in the world you will be welcomed by serious shooters who are familiar with whatever discipline you compete in?

mike H
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Location: JUNEE NSW

Re: Welcome or not

#5 Postby mike H » Thu Jul 16, 2015 7:53 am

Not sure what the problem is,unless your rifle calibre exceeds the range limits.Looks a nice rifle.
Forums are one thing,but they are not rifle ranges,join a club and start shooting.Welcome Gerhardt to Fclass shooting.

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Re: Welcome or not

#6 Postby MCLE » Thu Jul 16, 2015 8:51 am

Welcome Gerhardt
Don't worry about what you are using. As long as it is within the rules.
I used my Tactical rifles when I first started about 5 years ago and yes you get comments mostly just interested shooters and Friendly Banter.I have a Fclass rifle now
I like Seddo used my DTA and a couple of Acccuricy Internationals AE and AW and a Tubb 200.
So hardly Fclass rifles ( Except maybe the Tubb ) and I was made feel welcome at every club l went to and every comp I attended. Come and join in the fun. It's all about joining in picking the brains of the better shooters and gaining confidence in you ability to read the conditions not about what you are using. And I think its handy to have a good sence of humour as well this helps explain your bad shots :D
Thanks Michael H

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Re: Welcome or not

#7 Postby AlanF » Thu Jul 16, 2015 9:41 am

Welcome to the forum Gerhardt, and I can't see any problems with your rifle except you haven't revealed the calibre. Being a tactical I guess the most likely calibres are 308, 300WM or 338 Lap. The first one is no problem - depending on weight it could be legal in any of the 3 F-Classes. 300 WM will be legal for F-Class except that many ranges have muzzle energy limits which would force you to load well below max. 338 is above the 8mm limit for F-Class.

Regarding how your rifle looks, to me its more like an F-Class rifle than a "black gun". But regardless of that, everyone's entitled to their opinion about what is good looking gun. Most F-Classers will be more impressed by purpose built F-Class rifles than tactical. One good way of getting a rifle admired and accepted by the more conservative members is to demonstrate that it is competitive.

Keep us informed about how you get on with joining a club - we have enough members around the clubs that we may have a club close to you where you can be assured of a good welcome.

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Re: Welcome or not

#8 Postby DenisA » Thu Jul 16, 2015 5:35 pm

Welcome to F-Class Gerhardt. Awesome looking rifle you have there.

One of the things that I love about F-class is the diversity in equipment. Different rifle colours, stocks, equipment combinations, cartridges, etc, makes the atmosphere awesome. If I saw your rifle on the mound, I'd be very interested.

It's pretty common to see people start in F-class with a tactical or varmint rifle off a bi-pod because they want to learn to shoot long range and the primary goal is fun with their styled rifle that they love. Once you've been doing it for a short while, mixing with like minded accuracy nuts and start learning the ins and out's of precision and accuracy, you start wanting more and then you want to be competitive with the people you shoot with. This is the point that you see people who were once 100% devout to their tactical/varmint setups, move in to purpose built F-class rifles and equipment that use the rules to their fullest. This is also when you see their scores make a significant leap.

I've seen it work the other way too where new members honestly believe that you don't need an F-class rifle to be competitive against F-class rifles, they've persisted, not been able to consistently shoot competitive scores and become disillusioned with F-class and its members. You can have all the skill in the world but if your not using the appropriate equipment for any said discipline, your skills won't consistently shine through.

Your rifle looks like it will shoot long range very well as it is and may only require a few basic changes in setup to drastically improve its competitive potential.

Roy cobb
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Re: Welcome or not

#9 Postby Roy cobb » Thu Jul 16, 2015 8:04 pm

Welcome to the forum :D I have learnt a lot here and found it a very friendly place as well, as for the ranges I have been too they all have welcomed someone new and answered any questions I have had. So get out there and have a good time enjoying the sport of F class.

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Re: Welcome or not

#10 Postby .248WIN » Thu Jul 16, 2015 10:00 pm

Well well its just my luck as a new member to the sport and the forum to read this three topics as my start on the forum.
Helping F Class gro
DTA SRS for F Class
Something Needs to be Done

As I've said I'm not new to guns,but to Long Range.My wife and three daughters all enjoy shooting .My wife and two of my daughters even hunts with me.

I have read through the DTA and Something Needs To Be Done topics. As a new entry to the sport I can see that you fight more between your own classes than against anything else.You are your own enemy and will destroy your self ,before you let someone else have a piece of the cake.

Its quite clear that there is a huge frown on most of your faces,when someone pulls out a Tactical rifle (Terrorists are not welcome) aye. Its also clear that you need members. I suppose you need members for one reason only MONEY.even if there is only two guys left in the club .One can shoot and the other can pull the target right .But the bills won't be paid out of two members fee right.

I came into long range shooting because of searching on the net. and landed up on some forums for long range shooting and hunting so yes, the Norm I mentioned earlier is the the one, I thought he was,as in one of the topics he said he would put a poll up on the forum and for that reason I would say that Sedo must be the same person I know on that forum.

Now If I came across F class in the beginning I suppose I would have had a F class gun today.But I landed on the TERRORISTS forums and now I have a black gun in your opinion or at least the majority of F class guys.
You want members ,but just not terrorists.One thing I can say is this is not unique to Australia,the south african forums Im on and especially the Long rang Hunting forum tells the same story.F class and specific the Tr side is dying but they dont like the black guns to join.
After some F class guys got involved on the long range hunting forum there, The terrorists were invited to go for a shoot on the F class range and there is something happening.

Maybe this is al that the Tactical guys want to come to a range and learn about wind and have more trigger time.They like to shoot steel at unknown distances,range the distance,measure the wind altitude pressure and jump on a ballistic computer ,work out there drop and try to get a first round hit on a target one or two MOA.
Or at least this is what I think,as i'm not yet really involved yet.As I have only done some 100 yard load development with my gun. I was to afraid to take it with to the range .So my first LR shoot was with the .308 borrowed club gun.

Mabee the Tactical guys doesn't want to take over. Places for them to shoot is not as readily available as for other disciplines.

I think I'm just talking nonsense,I don't really know what is going on ,on either side.But I was really put off from F class .in what is going on in these three topics.

Maybe you need a independent person to look into the sport.
Maybe the sport needs to die a slow death till the last shooter turns up for a shoot with nobody to pull the target up and down

I dont know ,what I do know is you won't Unite, and you know how to push other people away ,to have the dwindling pei for your self.

I will still go to the range and see what happens when I pull my black gun out.I'll know then if i'm welcome on that range then.Honestly I see my terrorist friends shaking there fingers at me ,saying we told you so, we told you so.


Thanks for the guys that did, make me feel Welcome, I truly appreciate it,and I hope you are right.Must say the range I have attended.seems to be ok with Tac guns or at least that is what the guys said that I have spoken to

Greetings from


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Re: Welcome or not

#11 Postby DenisA » Thu Jul 16, 2015 10:35 pm

With anything in life you can focus on the negatives or focus on the positives. The route an individual takes is their own decision. You've only just come to this forum and your judging our community on 3 topics out of hundreds??

Any forum comprises of many people with many opinions on many subjects. If we all agreed always, there would be nothing to say.

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Re: Welcome or not

#12 Postby AlanF » Thu Jul 16, 2015 10:38 pm


That's an interesting barrel. I didn't know TSE (originally MAB) are doing 7mm, and is that a 1 in 7.? twist???


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Re: Welcome or not

#13 Postby .248WIN » Thu Jul 16, 2015 11:08 pm

Denis I agree with you,But I have been worn by five guys that I have shot with plus numerous guys,on forums .It took me 18 months to gather the nerve to go and ask. And I was really made welcome at the range I have attended. even after they knew I'm a bit aukward.

Yep I still need to go to the range and see what happens ,when I pack out my gun. Also these topics are old and much might have changed in that time.But Joining F claas ,stumble on to a F class forum ,and joining that. And two hours later and three topics you don't feel welcome anymore must tell you guys something.

On these topics,questions were asked,what must be done to save the sport.I don't want to judge the community. I think that the community is starting to judge them self .otherwise these questions wouldn't have been here. about Helping F class to grow.
I did not want to judge you. I have only tried to tell you how welcome I veel.

And I hope that the community might see something that can be change to help F class growing

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Re: Welcome or not

#14 Postby .248WIN » Thu Jul 16, 2015 11:14 pm

Hi Alan

Yep It is a 1 in 7.5 . I waned a 1 in 8 but at the time they only hat the 7.5 and I didn't want to wait. Everything else were ready.So I grabbed it. It might over stabilize Its setup for 162 AMAX.

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Re: Welcome or not

#15 Postby AlanF » Thu Jul 16, 2015 11:29 pm


In Queensland, some of the top shooters are using as little as 9.5 twist, and that's with 180gn. The most common would be 1 in 9. In South Australia 1 in 8.5s are common. Your 7.5 is much more than what is required, especially for the A-maxes, but many well respected ballisticians don't think you can "over-stabilise". Too much twist may however lead to a greater likelihood of having bullets blow up mid-air and possibly increased copper fouling. But if its a well finished bore, you may not have any problems.


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