AUSTRALIAN FCWC TEAM SELECTION

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bruce moulds
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Re: AUSTRALIAN FCWC TEAM SELECTION

#16 Postby bruce moulds » Mon Dec 10, 2018 10:41 am

without implying any disrespect to any parties, there seems to more to this than meets the eye.
bruce.
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Tim L
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Re: AUSTRALIAN FCWC TEAM SELECTION

#17 Postby Tim L » Mon Dec 10, 2018 11:17 am

AlanF wrote:Personally I don't think the performance of the Captain in an Australian F-Class team is a major determinant of success, particularly at World Championship level where there has always been a good amount of life experience and management ability across the team membership. If you select team members with the required ability, and willingness to do their best for the team, then you're very unlikely to falter. Maybe with a younger age profile, a strong leader is necessary, but in our case, not so much?

Whilst i can't disagree with you on the outcome Alan, i do disagree on the logic of your statement.
A good leader uses the abities to team members in a measured and coordinated manner to achieve the desired outcome. A poor leader relies on the team to figure it out for themselves. At the level of a world cup team we are lucky that most, if not all, know what needs to be done and all have the commitment to do what needs to be done and so we end up with a composition that can carry a captain, but thats not the point, nor the desired situation.
A good capain ensures that each individual is in a position to concentrate on their primary task of shooting and is not under pressure to achieve non primary functions. A good captain makes good and timely decisions, coordinates activities, ensures information is passed, remains aware of changing circumstances, has plans and alternative plans and backup plans.
In short, a good captain makes a team function effectively and is a vital part of that team. A good team 'might' achieve greatness, but a good team with good leadership has a far better chance.
We all, individually, spend hours chasing those 1% and even 0.1% improvements. Why would we even consider the captains slot as anything but vital. "Not a major detriment"- not acceptable! The captain needs to be a positive enhancement.

AlanF
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Re: AUSTRALIAN FCWC TEAM SELECTION

#18 Postby AlanF » Mon Dec 10, 2018 12:44 pm

I know what you mean Tim. In the ideal world, you would have a Captain who is perfect for the job, and then if that person does exist, they must be willing to put their hand up for the job. The reality is usually quite different, probably for other national teams as well.

jasmay
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Re: AUSTRALIAN FCWC TEAM SELECTION

#19 Postby jasmay » Mon Dec 10, 2018 1:27 pm

AlanF wrote:Personally I don't think the performance of the Captain in an Australian F-Class team is a major determinant of success, particularly at World Championship level where there has always been a good amount of life experience and management ability across the team membership. If you select team members with the required ability, and willingness to do their best for the team, then you're very unlikely to falter. Maybe with a younger age profile, a strong leader is necessary, but in our case, not so much?



Really Alan?

When critical decisions are made at the head it’s not often the body can do much about it.

The performance of the captain is just as, if not more important than that of the team, the ability for leaders to analyze situations and make tactical decisions is a key element in success.

Teams, although mostly run in a democratic manner, are ultimately an autocracy, when the captain makes a call it needs to be delivered in an intelligent manner that the team can get behind 100%.

Make no mistake, leadership is just as critical to success as is equipment that can hold waterline.

I couldn’t agree more with Shane’s comment, successful teams are built from experience and analysis of performance, feedback from all team members should be a key element in this.

AlanF
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Re: AUSTRALIAN FCWC TEAM SELECTION

#20 Postby AlanF » Mon Dec 10, 2018 2:33 pm

Jason,

I'm not arguing with Shane's comments. In fact I tried to encourage a post-mortem discussion forum immediately after FCWC 2013. Firstly, the response was not particularly encouraging, and when I offered what was there to the 2017 management to assist in their preparation, the offer was not taken up. I should add that the 2013 teams had benefitted substantially from the "reconnaissance mission" to Raton a year earlier.

Regarding captaincy, if it is as critical as you say, why have we not had stronger fields of candidates? Its a sign that there isn't enough encouragement by shooters in general to convince more good people to nominate i.e. its apparently not a major concern. And if it is, then unfortunately its too late for 2021 now.

sungazer
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Re: AUSTRALIAN FCWC TEAM SELECTION

#21 Postby sungazer » Mon Dec 10, 2018 2:39 pm

AlanF wrote:I know what you mean Tim. In the ideal world, you would have a Captain who is perfect for the job, and then if that person does exist, they must be willing to put their hand up for the job. The reality is usually quite different, probably for other national teams as well.


I think this is even more evident in the selection of some teams. The best shooters may not be great team players. The best shooters may not be able to take time out of there life to compete. This is where a Captain firstly may be able to select the best team members available that can and will work as a team.

ShaneG
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Re: AUSTRALIAN FCWC TEAM SELECTION

#22 Postby ShaneG » Mon Dec 10, 2018 4:04 pm

AlanF wrote:Jason,

I'm not arguing with Shane's comments. In fact I tried to encourage a post-mortem discussion forum immediately after FCWC 2013. Firstly, the response was not particularly encouraging, and when I offered what was there to the 2017 management to assist in their preparation, the offer was not taken up. I should add that the 2013 teams had benefitted substantially from the "reconnaissance mission" to Raton a year earlier.

Regarding captaincy, if it is as critical as you say, why have we not had stronger fields of candidates? Its a sign that there isn't enough encouragement by shooters in general to convince more good people to nominate i.e. its apparently not a major concern. And if it is, then unfortunately its too late for 2021 now.


I know I put some comments up at the time Alan?

As to debrief reports it should be a mandatory responsibility / task for each team member to undertake post FCWC.
NRAA makes it so and assesses the feedback for positive forward effort.

AlanF
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Re: AUSTRALIAN FCWC TEAM SELECTION

#23 Postby AlanF » Mon Dec 10, 2018 4:29 pm

ShaneG wrote:I know I put some comments up at the time Alan?

You certainly were one of the "few" Shane, so you've been a long term advocate for debriefing and learning from it. Maybe we can still organise a debrief forum out of Canada 2017, then this time have it used by the next team.

jasmay
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Re: AUSTRALIAN FCWC TEAM SELECTION

#24 Postby jasmay » Mon Dec 10, 2018 6:17 pm

Alan, are you aware of who the nominee’s were for FTR? I would hazard a guess given your comment that you are not, otherwise I don’t think you would have made such a comment.

AlanF
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Re: AUSTRALIAN FCWC TEAM SELECTION

#25 Postby AlanF » Mon Dec 10, 2018 8:40 pm

jasmay wrote:Alan, are you aware of who the nominee’s were for FTR? I would hazard a guess given your comment that you are not, otherwise I don’t think you would have made such a comment.

I was referring to F-Open on the subject of nominees for Captain, and you're correct that I haven't heard who nominated for F/TR. But I believe the OP was mainly concerned about the F-Open situation.

Tim L
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Re: AUSTRALIAN FCWC TEAM SELECTION

#26 Postby Tim L » Mon Dec 10, 2018 9:16 pm

AlanF wrote:
jasmay wrote:Alan, are you aware of who the nominee’s were for FTR? I would hazard a guess given your comment that you are not, otherwise I don’t think you would have made such a comment.

I was referring to F-Open on the subject of nominees for Captain, and you're correct that I haven't heard who nominated for F/TR. But I believe the OP was mainly concerned about the F-Open situation.

How was the F open nominee list not a "strong field"? I don't know who else nominated but with just Craig and Dennis its a damned strong field. Non multa sed multum.

AlanF
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Re: AUSTRALIAN FCWC TEAM SELECTION

#27 Postby AlanF » Mon Dec 10, 2018 9:41 pm

Tim L wrote:How was the F open nominee list not a "strong field"?

I think that's pretty simple. More nominees means more choice. For whatever reason (which escapes me) that Craig was not re-appointed, then there was only one alternative.

GSells
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Re: AUSTRALIAN FCWC TEAM SELECTION

#28 Postby GSells » Mon Dec 10, 2018 9:58 pm

Anyway, can we as I said before , move on . Both Craig and Den would have and or will succeed. We need put the decision behind us and move forward. A debriefing is always a good idea as we can always improve. There are some serious hurdles ( Safety being one ) that have to be addressed for the Management team which they all need our support. Time to move on .

jasmay
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Re: AUSTRALIAN FCWC TEAM SELECTION

#29 Postby jasmay » Mon Dec 10, 2018 10:19 pm

Agree with Graham, time to move along, there will be a tough journey ahead for those involved, good luck to all.

Tim L
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Re: AUSTRALIAN FCWC TEAM SELECTION

#30 Postby Tim L » Mon Dec 10, 2018 10:32 pm

AlanF wrote:
Tim L wrote:How was the F open nominee list not a "strong field"?

I think that's pretty simple. More nominees means more choice. For whatever reason (which escapes me) that Craig was not re-appointed, then there was only one alternative.

I'm sorry Allan I'm not trying to play semantics but a long list of unsuitable candidates does not equate to a strong field. Nor does it equate to more choice. It just equates to a long list of unsuitable candidates. I select graduate engineers for some of the most sought after positions in the country. I know all about long lists of unsuitable candidates The strength of the field comes from the suitability of the candidates not the size of the list.
One could say that the field is strong if the decision is hard. A weak field makes the decision easy.
As for Dennis being the only other candidate i don't know. There may have been more. Either way, if it was just him and Craig the board was looking at two very suitable candidates. I don't know why Craig didn't get it and i do feel the board owes an explanation.
But I'm also with the G man. Regardless of opinion its time to get behind the respective captains. The selection process is something the NRAA Board needs to address.


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